Abby’s Guide > Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) > Discussions > Ariens is at it again.......
Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions |
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aa335
 
Joined: Nov 29, 2008
Points: 2434
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Re: Ariens is at it again.......
Reply #10 Aug 30, 2010 1:43 pm |
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Mikie &aa-It's hard to enter into a discussion of this kind without sounding condescending,arrogant or self important so let me say that is not my intent and I trust you will take my word for it. The reality is that displacement and torque ratings (cc&ft. lbs.) don't make engines the same. How is a manufacturer to indicate their engine is different from a competitors if the engine is produced by the same vendor and has the same displacement? Is the language used to describe the chute control a little flamboyant? Perhaps, but you & I are "into " snow removal at a different level than 99% of the rest of humanity. "Ice auger" to my mind simply indicates that the chute control will work even in iced up conditions. If you ever owned a machine where this wasn't the case you have no idea what a "pita" that is. More importantly how is a manufacturer to indicate a difference in their machine other than to bring it to the attention of the consumer by using language that says"Hey,look at this". I am far more offended by Toro's fairy tale of not having shear pins and insisting that their gear box will survive anything. They simply put the pins in a non traditional place in the drive system and call them by another name. Their "Game Boy" plastic chute control has evolved into a machine that is more plastic than steel. I for the life of me can't understand why this has been accepted as being a good thing. Yes it works ok in powder conditions but try it on a Cul De Sac in the North East where the plows leave the EOD in what ammounts to an icy glacier 10' wide. There -not so good. The plastic dosen't hold up. I know this comment is going to bring rain but having purchased a Honda for my Brother In Law as a house warming gift and both using and working on it I would never buy another. The engine and drive are first rate but the chasis is under designed for use in areas as described above. They also refuse to change the design so that it is comfortable for an operator over 5"8"tall and the charged for handle extensions offer very little in the way of relief. Tracks are great until you have to make a turn and wrestling one around a garage is no fun. Users with gravel drives have complained forever about them digging in and Honda's response has been to offer an accessory set of skids(extra charge) with reportedly mediocre results.This brings us to their wheeled machines which have no differential available and for what you get are perhaps the lowest value of any unit on the market. I don't think Ariens units are perfect but do appreciate the fact they produce a machine for every user from budget to Pro. They also keep parts availability current for units that are ancient by OPE standards and are available everywhere, They also provide after market parts through their Stens subsidiary which is a great alternative for those of us trying to keep antique machines of all brands running. I could continue but run the risk of being labeled an "Ariens Toady". Let me close by saying because they sell their budget lines through box stores where set up and service is suspect their reputation has taken a hit. I am sure they are aware of this but weighed against the current forces in the market they have determined it necessary to stay in business. Who am I to question that decision? The market will dictate the wisdom of their decision and from what I understand they are doing pretty well. Please excuse the rant, Marc Marc, Not to start any flame wars, but I'll say as I see it in case someone is contemplating on getting a shiny new Honda to consider carefully. Having owned Honda's biggest two stage (HS1132), I can safely say as much as I am impressed with it's snow removing capability and the power, quietness, and smoothness of the engine, it is the machine that gives me frustration in handling as well. The steering could use differential trigger lock in which you let one side of the tracks free wheel while the other is powered. The side skids should be longer and wider to allow the bucket to float over pavement or road surface irregularities. As far as the handle height, I find it is perfect for me. However, the handle could use another 5 inches further back behind the rear wheels and spaced wider apart to give me more leverage. Toro has this just right, IMO. Push the handle down and the bucket just rise effortlessly. Push the handle left and right and the bucket changes direction instantly. I also like Toro's "gameboy" QuickStick chute control, despite being plastic. It is quick alright, but has nowhere the precision of a geared chute control. If and when Yamaha markets and sells their snowblowers in the US which offer these features that makes it more friendly, I'd gladly trade in the Honda for a Yamaha. Honda hasn't seen serious competition lately so they won't listen to customers and change a thing. Rest assured, the Honda you buy in 2005 is the same as one in 2010. The Honda kicks butt when it comes to throwing snow where you want it. But it also demands physical and mental concentration so that it doesn't start taking you over and dragging you along for a walk. It is a 250 lb mechanical bulldog.
This message was modified Aug 30, 2010 by aa335
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mml4
Snow is good,
Deep snow is better!
Joined: Dec 31, 2003
Points: 544
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Re: Ariens is at it again.......
Reply #11 Aug 30, 2010 3:05 pm |
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aa- Your comments regarding handle placement and balance are spot on.I have the last generation TroyBilt before MTD took them over. The machine was built for them by Bolens and is an 824. It weighs 290LB. but is so well balanced you would never imagine it was that heavy. Having experienced a machine with a differential I would never consider one without it. Another item rarely dicussed is tires. I changed out Carlisle Snow Hogs for a set of X-Tracs at a friends suggestion. The difference is day and night. I've had machines with chains in the past and can honestly say the X-Tracs are every bit as good. This with the added bonus of not having damage to the black top or concrete. 92 degrees here on Long Island and I'm dreaming of snow- Marc
SnapperV210P,Toro22177,TroyBilt42010Snowthrower,Craftsman Shredder,American Turbo Pressure Washer HondaGX200,Stihl011Saw,EchoPas260Trimmer Edger,EchoPB602Blower,EchoHCR150Hedge Clipper
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Snowmann
Joined: Dec 3, 2003
Points: 494
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Re: Ariens is at it again.......
Reply #13 Sep 2, 2010 10:19 pm |
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C'mon Mikie-Apples to apples. The Sno Tek line isn't meant to compete with the 2 stage Toros but rather to be a less expensive alternative. May I suggest we agree to compare units from the different manufacturers that are at the same price point. Marc Not necessary Marc. The Sno-Tek chute is equal or better than the Toro PowerMax chute. The main chute body is made from virgin high-end (6.9 melt index) HDPE with a -105F brittle temperature and .180" wall thickness. Most plastic chutes are .125 or .150 (the Toro PowerMax chute is however equal in thickness at .180"). Also, every attachment point on the Sno-Tek chute is reinforced with steel backing plates (also with a steel hinge and 17 steel rivets, not depicted). The deflector cap and handle are also made from steel (steel parts are shown in yellow). This is not the case on the Toro. Along with extensive field testing, this chute was impacted 90,000 cycles with a pneumatic cylinder at -15F with no damage, then impacted repeatedly with a .50" steel ball shot from an air tank/gun at 100psi at -15F with only small surface dings resulting (air gun fixture pictured). No cracks, no shattering. The old timers here on this forum might remember that this was not the case with the early PowerMax chutes and impeller housings (~2004?). As mentioned above, the price disparity between the Sno-Tek and PowerMax isn't small. The Sno-Tek line top to bottom costs roughly half of the Toro PowerMax line, yet still posses an equivalent (or better) chute. Mikie, in lieu of you forfeiting the deed to your house (we can't leave you homeless), please leave a dollar or two in the nearest Children's Hospital donation can when you see one ;-)  
This message was modified Sep 3, 2010 by Snowmann
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jviera1298
Joined: Aug 11, 2010
Points: 18
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Re: Ariens is at it again.......
Reply #15 Sep 4, 2010 12:04 pm |
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Truthfully, Mikie sounds like some sort of middle or high school child. I wouldn't waste too much time trying to convince someone like him that he is wrong, it'll just turn into more childish mud slinging. I think we all acknowledge that Ariens makes a good product, and that every company has their little naming quirks to try to make something as boring as a snowblower and its components (to the mainstream) sound interesting and unique to get the sale.
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Steve_Cebu
Joined: Dec 17, 2009
Points: 888
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Re: Ariens is at it again.......
Reply #17 Sep 4, 2010 10:14 pm |
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I have a Toro 1028 with the joystick and yeah the chute is plastic but durable and according to my local dealer they don't really break unless you hit it with something. I can't speak about brands i haven't owned but I've seen some plastic chutes on machines in Home Depot that looked ultra cheap. All the companies make Low, middle and high end machines. So I seriously doubt that a $200-300 snowblower will equal a $1,300 snowblower. You tend to get what you pay for. I like everything about the Toro 1028 I have. Honda has screwed itself by not putting a differential lock on their machine IMO. If you like Sno-Tek or whatever brand buy it. But if it doesn't work as well as other brands well..... I like Toro, Honda, and Yamaha. Ariens has dissapointed me wit their reduction in quality from what I saw at the dealer. Oh and they sold out of Toro before Ariens. That doesn't mean Ariens isn't good but it does offer some things the Ariens doesn't. In that price range they are all pretty darn good machines. Vote with your wallet. :)
"If you have more miles on your snow blower than your car, you live in New England." "If you can drive 75 mph through 2 feet of snow during a raging blizzard without flinching, you live in New England."
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jviera1298
Joined: Aug 11, 2010
Points: 18
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Re: Ariens is at it again.......
Reply #18 Sep 5, 2010 10:37 pm |
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Mikie, I didnt say anything about the SnoTek machines... I simply commented on your immature posting style and the fact that a similarly priced Ariens is every bit as good as a Toro. SnoTek units are cheaper than equivalent Toro units, so you really cant compare them fairly... they have their place. I'll take the metal chute over the plastic one on the Toro, and the control on the Ariens I just feel like will work in icy conditions better than the joystick. Ive seen stories of those joysticks freezing up from time to time. I think Toro makes a good unit, as well as Ariens. Mikie's bashing of Ariens is about their naming conventions and a pitiful apples to oranges comparison between SnoTek (budget) models and Toros models which are in the price range of the higher end Ariens series.
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