Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I know that this has been brought up many times before, but I wanted to hit this one again.  Most know that Tecumseh is now bankrupt and there are no engines available and there are no plans to make any more engines at this point.  It doesn't mean that they will never make any engines, but right now nothing is for sure.  Ariens was always a proud user of the Tecumseh snow king line of engines.  How would you feel about buying an Ariens with a Tecumseh engine in it right now?

I was in Home Depot this weekend and saw the latest batches of the 927LE.  These new units came with Briggs Snow Max engines that produced 13.5 foot pounds of torque and sold for $1050.  .  The Ariens web site does not reflect this change yet.  I think the Snow King engines are very nice units that have proven themselves in the field or in this case the snow.  The other reason to use Tecumseh for Ariens was always a marketing way to differentiate themselves from products put out by B&S, including the B&S name plate, John Deere, and Simplicity to name just a few (I'm sure there are many more).

When I think of snow engines I personally think pretty simplistically.  I think of the Tecumseh, B&S, Honda and the many Chinesse engines no matter who's name plate is on the sheet metal.  Would love to hear your comments.

Rick

"Sad to see Tecumseh go the way of the dodo bird and with Honda and now Yamaha selling snow throwers, how long can American brands compete?"

With the recent down turn in product quality of a couple of prominent snow thrower manufacturers in order for them to enter into the box store market, and the continued consistent quality of Honda and now Yamaha, I'd say the plan for self destruction is pretty much set for domestic manufacturers.    Look at the auto sector in Detroit.  Their arrogance and hubris allowed them to keep their heads in the sand for almost 40 years.  The writing has been on the wall for at least that long and finally, they've pulled their heads out  just in time to read the bad news.   A loyal customer who learns that the new machine they have just purchased is not nearly as robust as the one of the same brand that they are replacing, will not be coming back for another one.  In addition to that, he/she will not be giving the new machine very good reviews when it starts to break down.   The logic of compromised manufacturing quality eludes me. 

And....I don't buy the "advanced more efficient productions methods" smoke screen either.  Cheap is cheap, plain and simple.   

Clay wrote:
First of all I don't think Tecumseh went bankrupt.  I believe they were bought out by an equity fund who just
threw that division in the garbage once they got their hands on the parts they were interested in.  This kind
of thing bothers me more than any possible decrease in quality that may be happening in the industry.

When I bought my new Ariens in November / December I knew that Tecumseh was finished but I bought
the machine with its Tecumseh engine anyway.  I have no experience with B&S engines but the Tecumseh
10hp L-head on my old snowblower has lasted ten years without requiring anything other than oil changes
so I felt pretty confident about the new one doing the same.

Paul

Earlier, someone asked for a link.  I see that additional research was done, but here is an article from the time period when Tecumseh's desmise was first reported.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122602502818007621.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

mfduffy wrote:

I couldn't read the whole article without subscribing but thanks for the link. 

borat wrote:

Toyota came out with the Camray in 1983 and that model continues to flourish today.  By contrast in 1983 I bought a Chevrolet Citation (mid sized family car).  Chevrolet made the Citation from 1980 to 1985.  Then they replaced it with the Chevy Celebrity which was produced until 1989 when it was replaced by the Lumina, which was latter replaced by the Impala.  

Detroit strategy was to launch a new model every few years which meant that brand loyalty was impossible.  I loved my Chevy Citation but it's hard to be a repeat customer or recommend a model thats out of production.  Toyota's strategy was to stay committed to the Camary model and simply keep making it better. Obviously someone that bought a Toyota Camary in 1983 and loved it can still be a repeat buyer and a brand advocate.

I see the same problem with current US snow thrower companies.  Ariens, for example, comes out with a virtually new model line-up every other year or so.  Two years ago I bought an Ariens 11528 LE...today that model doesn't exist so I can't recommend it to anyone.

Paul7 wrote:
Not exactly. You bought an Ariens Deluxe. They still make Ariens Deluxe models.

Even taking a small (and short) random snapshot in time 2002-2006 (per Wiki), the Camry had 4 different available engines, 5 different transmissions, and base trim, SE, SE Sport, LE, SLE, XLE version, a 2 door convertible version, styling updates, etc. (and none of the yearly offerings were exactly the same in any given year).

Seems the same to me.

PK

Paul7 wrote:
We buy all of our vehicles new and run them for a long time.  The Toyota strategy worked for this household.  We've been driving Toyota's for thirty years.  The last North American vehicle I bought was a pick up back in 1986.  As per usual, it was nothing but trouble.  My wife was driving a seven year old Toyota that was less trouble than my new truck.  As soon as Toyota started making bigger pick up trucks, I bought one.  I've never looked back.  I could afford to buy North American vehicles, just couldn't afford to operate them.  They've lost this customer for life.

Today's global automotive market killed all the old "Jap vs US vs Euro" car stuff. You have vehicles from traditionally japanese labels engineered, designed, and manufactured outside of Japan, and Fords with more european content and design than US. Mazda Tributes are Ford Escapes. Hondas are made in Ohio, and Chevies and Toyotas roll off the same assembly line in California. It's been decades since Volvo was a Swedish company.

You can't say one country makes better/worse cars. One period last year, the Mercury Milan beat EVERY Honda in JD Power Quality rankings. Just like our beloved blowers, you have to go by the individual model, not the brand.

I liked it better the old way.

Bill_H wrote:
Not to knock Fords or Mercury's, but the JD Powers rating is "initial quality". Fit , finish, and first blush impressions. It says nothing for long term durability. Remember when the Renault Alliance was the Motor Trend car of the year? (and the cars were sold with that exact proclamation on a banner in the window). It also made the Car and Driver's Ten Best. They were all in a salvage yard in short order.

PK

I don't drive awards or publications.  I drive vehicles.  I know what my experience has taught me.  I've learned valuable and expensive lessons in automotive ownership.  Lesson no. 1:  A vehicle that needs less repairs tends to be more readily accessible and inexpensive to operate.  Lesson no. 2:  Lower initial price of vehicle is not necessarily a bargain if that same vehicle will cost many thousands of dollars more in repairs over the long run. 

All four of our Toyotas combined over a period of thirty years of ownership were  probably 1/10th as costly in repairs than one of my North American vehicles.   In addition to that, I always had a Toyota in our own garage at night rather than in the repair shop.  It's a defining moment when you get up to go to work in the morning, go to the garage and remember your transportation is in getting fixed AGAIN but the wife's old Toyota is in the garage.  You'll need a ride to work again.  After a few of these events, one begins to connect the dots....  I connected them a long time ago.