Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

... when you bend down to operate the axle-mounted lock pin at the left wheel, on the '05 and older models. This has really bothered me, and the new models no longer have this problem due to the new axle design and remote control system.

My fix was to fabricate a small deflector from a 3" x 3" piece of thin stainless steel. I carefully bent it into an "S" shape in my bench vise and pop-rivited it to 2 existing holes in the muffler face - the two holes are the outer ones closest to the rear of the thrower. I drilled the holes oversized and installed the deflector with 3/16 inch stainless pop rivets. These are very hard to find, but a bolt or boat supply company (like West Marine) will have them at about US$1 each.  Plain steel or aluminum rivets will not hold up in this environment - the heat and vibration will loosen and corrode them severely in a couple of winters. The steel should be available in the scrap bin of any metal fabrication shop.

I made sure the deflector did not stick out to the left beyond 1 inch, so that the black muffler heat shield would still fit correctly.

The mod works GREAT! No hot carbon monoxide blasted into the eyes and lungs. The exhaust stream is broken up rather than a concentrated stream, and most of it exits straight forward and up, with a little bit going down. I have not thrown snow yet, but I don't see how the mod can have any measureable impact on engine performance.

I highly recommend this mod if you own an older DLE.

John Davies

Great idea! I have a 2003 Ariens 1128DLE and noticed that nasty problem the first Winter.  I will look for stainless steel screws at
Home Depot as I lost my pop-riviter. 

I wrote to Ariens in 2004 on their website and suggested they they use a cable to engage the differential. I guess they listen to their customers.

I consider this situation to be a serious health and safety risk, and Ariens should fix it with no charge to the customer. I have just now emailed the company with a description of this very simple mod, and a request that they issue a Service Bulletin to modify at no charge ALL '05 and earlier DLEs that come into the dealer's service departments.

However, if for some bizarre reason they don't feel a SB is needed, they should at least make available an inexpensive deflector kit, including the correct SS rivets, through their dealer Parts Departments.

I urge all concerned DLE owners to contact  Ariens concerning this exhaust issue. Mention the words "health" and "safety" in your email - that will get the lawyer's attention ;)

http://www.ariens.com/customer_service/contact_us/

BTW: Has anyone suffered any real effects from getting face-blasted - as in feeling faint or dizzy, receiving burns,  or losing a contact lens?

John Davies

JohnEDavies wrote:
They have used the wheel hub mounted system for at least 20 years and probably a couple hundred thousand units. It certainly is an annoyance and that's a nice, simple solution if you are so inclined.

John,

Sounds like a great idea. Perhaps can we ge get a PIC on your invetion? Best of luck Allan.

I will try to snap and post a pic - meanwhile, Ariens does nothing:

QUOTE:

I am in receipt of your e-mail regarding the deflector you fabricated for your snow blower. While I understand your concern over the exhaust direction, this unit, and all units manufactured by the Ariens Company, has passed all requirements set forth in the ANSI Standards. I have passed your concerns on to our Engineering Department for future consideration, and we appreciate your being an Ariens customer.
Dave Miller

UNQUOTE

I wonder just exactly what the ANSI standards for facial exhaust exposure are....?

John Davies

JohnEDavies wrote:

Lets be real.Do you actualy think they will ever admit to something so below the belt. We just have to do what makes it work and the heck with the Engineering Department

Best of luck and can't wait for the PIC

How about lets be fair?

As mentioned, Ariens has produced hundreds of thousands of these machines with the hub release over at least 30 years.  I have a 1972 dealer manual that shows them so equipped.

If you got one complaint about something over 30 years, just how urgent would you consider the matter?  Especially if it was extremely emotional and derogatory.

Deflecting the exhaust up is a bad idea, because you may be directing carbon monoxide  up towards your face. Carbon Monoxide is lethal in a concentation of about 9% in air.  If you want to do this, that's fine. Ariens would be crazy to do any such thing without study in the extraordinarily wide range of conditions these machines operate under.

Ariens very likely does what any other company does. They record all the customer requests for improvements, or problems. They prioritize them on the basis of safety; performance; and manufacturing cost. Then they pick the ones they think can be staffed for production for the following season and proceed. Some ideas will be implemented years later: others fall off the list. Many top companies consistently deliver 8 of 10 top customer requests year after year. It's not left to chance. The fact that an Ariens engineer monitors this forum should demonstrate their commitment to the end user.

Garandman wrote:
How long has the axle lock been around - is it 30 years? It is simply not an issue with other models becuase you don't have to bend down beside the muffler to operate it..

What percentage of owners have just said "Screw it" and never complained? I would be willing to bet it is well over 90%.

Deflecting the exhaust up is a bad idea, but having a concentrated blast blow _directly_ in your face is not? Come on!!!  Most of it goes forward anyway with my mod.

Does Ariens monitor this forum directly? I was unaware of that. The quote was from a private email to the factory.

I don't think I am excessively derogatory about this issue. If you have ever had this occur I think you would be wanting them to fix it also.

John

" How long has the axle lock been around - is it 30 years? It is simply not an issue with other models becuase you don't have to bend down beside the muffler to operate it.. "

Oh yes you do , or did . all there machines with the lock at the wheel was the same .  I have an 1128dle and the same thing happens to me. But let me say, Putting a deflector is not the best idea without study first.  30 seconds of exaust in your face while changing the position of the lock would be much safer than 1 hour of deflected exaust in the dense cold air puffing in small amounts into your lungs while you are blowing snow . .  If there was something made by Ariens to modify the exaust I would put it on but I would not chance a mod like you did. I am sure you could have an exaust pipe made like the old minibikes had which is a tube with the muffler on the end of it. .

John,

The owners manual states "Stop engine and remove ignition key prior to leaving the operator's position for any reason". This would include locking the axle with the older style locking mechanism as well as the axle pin on pin-lock models. This feature was never intended to be used with the engine running. Leaving the operator's position while the unit is running is never a good idea from a safety standpoint. To offer some kind fix fof this would be to condone leaving the operator position while the engine is running. Certainly, we would never do this.

Is this inconvenient in contemporary context (having to shut the unit off to lock or unlock the diff)? Yes. However, compared to the a large majority of competitive snothros on the market over the last 35 years or so (since the inception of this feature), this was innovative and convenient. Most other snothros had no features at all to turn the unit or lock the axle short of a pin-lock. As power steering and individually clutching wheels have become more common place with modern snothros, this feature has become comparatively inconvenient. That is why the feature was updated for 2005 with a remote lock.

I'm fairly sure there is a stock deflector available to mount to this muffler for those that want to channel the exhaust somewhere other than the stock configuration. Certainly take Garandman's advice and do not channel the exhaust upwards. Forward, or 45 degrees downward and forward would likely be the best orientations. Most deflectors have the availability to orient in 45 degree clock positions. One of our design engineers is checking with Tecumseh to see if the deflector kit exists and what the part number is.

Paul Koltz

Engineering Leader

Snow Products

Ariens Company

Well, I have said my piece and really did not want to get into a shoutingf match with anyone. I apologize if anyone got upset.

I will test out my mod at the next snowfall, and leave instrauctions with my wife to publish a folow up here if I keel over dead.

Here is a link with a picture:

https://home.comcast.net/~johnedavies/page5.htm

You guys can decide for yourselves ;)

John Davies

Well, I have said my piece and really did not want to get into a shoutingf match with anyone.


Yes you did, you've been yelling about it for a fricking year now, I ran across it while searching this forum. The same suggestion was given to you last winter. What would you call someone who picked up a piece of meat off a hot grill and stuck it in their mouth and then yelled because they burned themselves? An idiot? What would you call a person that went to fix a flat right rear tire on their car and left the engine running so the exhaust that comes out right behind the right rear wheel blows in their face while changing the tire? An idiot? I realize I am new here but I couldn't let this go without comment after reading it.

Drillertoo wrote:
Every lawn mower manufacturer took steps MANY years ago to prevent people from walking around their running mowers to clear the discharge chute - too many people were losing hands. They put plastic skirts behind the decks to prevent people in sandles from getting their toes chopped off. Chain saw manufacturers put chain brakes on the bars to prevent homeowners from chopping off their legs when they set down their saws. Trimmer manufacturers put deflectors at the trim heads to keep flying rocks from blinding the operator. Consumers as a whole have NO common sense and steps like these are necessary!

Ariens has made this machine for 3 decades. I have no idea if this exhaust thing was an issue then or even 5 years ago -  maybe at some point they went to a different engine design or supplier and this problem suddenly appeared. Their solution was to tell the owner to shut off the engine every time they want to operate the diff lock. This is the lawyers tallking, not the engineers. If an owner can simply take one step sideways, grab the left grip with the right hand, and reach down to operate the lock with the engine running, HE WILL DO SO.

Ariens should recognise this, and that is why I contacted them. Simply telling the owner to shut the engine off is unacceptable, especially when a simple 5 minute deflector mod could eliminate the problem entirely.

You can call me an idiot all you want in a private email, and then I will feel free to call you names in return. Do it in public and it is not just juvenile and impolite, it is totally  inappropriate and you owe me an apology.

John Davies

JohnED,

                CONCUR!!!!!

                                           Fred

Drillertoo,

You are entitled to your opinion, but personally I think you were rude and disrespectful, especially for a person who has a total of four posts here.

John is also entitled to his opinion, and even though this is not a new concern to him, factoring in the new changes Ariens brought to the new 2005 snowblowers, it is still an interesting topic of discussion. His bringing it up again is also warranted because of the solution he came up with.

If we still had the "old mods" who used to be here, (a fine bunch of guys I might add)  your insolence would not have been tolorated.

Flaming has never been allowed here in the past......if that has changed it would just be another reason why some of the best people here have gone over to the "other" OPE forum.

There is a big difference between "flaming" and disagreeing with what a person posts......hopefully you will learn the difference.

Frank D.

Consumers as a whole have NO common sense and steps like these are necessary!


In your case I agree. You made a modification to keep the lack of common sense from being a problem, I'm sure it was a good idea. Now it blows upward into your face. I stand corrected, no idiocy there. 

That deflector was nicely done & I applaud someone trying to improve something.

BUT - Stopping & restarting is an inconvienience when it comes to safety? I'm sorry, but that is just plain LAZY & irresponsible. With this new deflector addition, the exhaust will now blow in your face when one goes to clear the auger, which will probably be done with the engine running. ANY TIME YOU LEAVE THE OPERATOR POSITION FOR ANY REASON, THE ENGINE SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN FOR SAFETY!! I feel that someone's safety is PARAMOUNT & ALL measures should be taken to keep yourself safe! Don't wait for someone else to do it for you, be smart & work safely folks!

Operating OPE is dangerous & some common sense must ALWAYS be excercised. Unfortunately in today's society, no one assumes ANY accountability - its always someone else's fault no matter what.

Marty

JohnEDavies wrote:
Sir, to reiterate, your deflector does not "solve" the problem. It redirects the exhaust stream in a way that may cause you to be breathing carbon monoxide while the machine is running and moving forward, if I understand the picture.  The exhaust isn't just an incovenience: it's deadly. No one else should attempt this modification without serious consideration about the dangers of an unengineered approach.

The change in back pressure of the exhaust may not impact the performance of the engine. But you have not even used it to blow snow yet, have you? And you've heard from the Ariens engineering staff about the other considerations.

The new machines have completely resolved the problem . If it is so important to you, why not sell the machine and get one of the new models? It probably wouldn't cost you more than a few hundred dollars.

There is plenty of discourtesy and contempt in this thread already, on several fronts.  You have made your point: reiterating it again and again is not helpful or interesting.

This is all very interesting and I had no idea my posts would stir up such a hotbed of emotion. It was NEVER my intent, which is one reason I resented being publicly called an idiot, for which that poster has not yet apologized....

Everyone is certainly welcome to voice their varied opinions. Mine is quite simply that the redirected CO isn't a factor in the outdoors. I did a similar mod on a Troybilt Horse rototiller and it worked fine and I never passed out or even noticed any additional fumes while in the garden, over a period of over 12  years. We will see with this one..

I will fully test my mod when I get a chance and make another post after the first snowstorm, regarding the exhaust.

Thanks for all the feedback.

John Davies

The Ariens rep has stayed in the loop. While not condoning my mod in any way, he gave me this information which may be of help to owners of late model 926DLEs at least - I don't know about fitment on other models.

QUOTE:

I have been informed by the engine manufacturer, Tecumseh, that they
have a deflector available as a Service Part.  The Tecumseh part 
numbers
are as follows:

(1) 35428 Deflector

(4) 650760 Screws

Dave Miller 
Ariens Technical / Warranty Service 

UNQUOTE

John Davies

Hi,

If anyone buys that deflector for their Ariens 926, would you please post a Pic.

I have a 9HP  OHV Tec engine on a husky and want to see if the deflector would work on my blower or other blowers.

                                                Thanks

                                                                    Fred