Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I'm restoring an old Ariens Sno Thro and one of the rakes is seemingly locked to the shaft. Guy at work put it on a 40 ton hydraulic press and it still didn't budge - just started distorting the rake. He didn't heat it though.

I have a second parts snowblower and the rake is stuck on that one as well. The difference is that one is on the "closed" side of the gearbox so I could remove the axle shaft if necessary.

I'm was thinking of getting as much penetrating oil on it as possible, putting a gear puller on it, leaving ot for a few days, tighten the puller, etc. Any other suggestions? Both gearboxes are nice and tight and they're the old cast iron ones so I'd like to rescue both of them.

I wouild try soaking it with KROIL penetrating oil . Spray it everyday for a week. If that does not free it i dont know what will.

http://www.kanolabs.com/

The problem is it can only penetrate from one end and the hole where the shear pin was. Think it will still work?

Kroil is supposed to creep. I have used it and it does seem to creep. So if any oil will do it this should.

I also recommend a good penatrating oil and Kroil is one of the best. Just remember that you can't use too much. Spray it twice a day if you can, and patience while it works.

If all else fails, get a small angle grinder and cut a slot along the rake.
Following the curve of the rakes. Cut about 4" along the shaft in different locations and spray penatrating oil in and try pressing on it again. Penatrating oil and cutting slots will break the rust holding the rakes to the shaft.
I believe another member (majorexceler8,marty) also did it this way and he got them free.
Other members will be able to come up with a lot of ideas to keep you trying till the snow really flies.
T.J. terry

Garandman - as TJ mentioned above, I had a major BATTLE removing a stuck rake on an older Sears machine. I tried the very same methods you have with no results. I ended up taking an air powered cutoff wheel & making an incision the length of the auger rake "tube". This will release some of the grip that is keeping the rake from coming off. Then, hit it with a good shot of PB Blaster or Kroil & let it sit for a solid day. If worse comes to worse, using a torch & heating the tube at this point WILL get the rake off. Resist hammering on the auger SHAFTs - the ends will get peened over making removal more difficult, and you could also damage the ends, which in turn may make a bearing or retaining clip not fit properly during reassembly (I made this mistake). You could also jam 2 pipes in the rakes & try to spin the rakes in opposite directions, while having the assembly chocked in a solid bench vise - this was suggested by another member whose name escapes me right now (Ralph?). I wish you luck & work SLOWLY as to not damage anything!

Marty

I am planning to take it slowly to a small engine dealer in NH, who has had success getting them off by a combination of pressure and heat.

I made a press with a hydraulic jack and several days of lubing it and pressure did nothing but bend a 1/2" steel bolt.....

Garandman - once its off, you will need to clean up the shaft's insides. I used a long wooden dowel with a piece of sandpaper taped on. When reassembling, I used never-seize liberally to keep this from ever happening again. Hopefully heat & pressure will get these parts "divorced" . My cut tube had to be JB welded, ground down smoothly & painted to restore the part.

Marty

Yes, it was me that rotated the augers against themselves, except  I used a pair of 2x4s, not pipes.  I tried PB Blaster for about a week, along with applied tension from a gear puller on the shaft and some banging with a brass hammer- I don't really know if that did anything.  When I finally got the auger loose, I was also applying lots of heat (MAPP gas) during the process and just kept at it.  I did start one of the 2x4s on fire a little.  I also cooked one of the seals on the shaft. 

Someone else cracked the cast housing while trying the 2x4 thing, so be careful. 

I would not put a machine back together without freeing the auger.  Sort of like not having a shear pin. 

I still have the parts in my basement, ready to put back together.  Since the weather is still in the 80s and 90s, it's not on my radar yet.  Probably after the first frost. 

Good Luck

RalphS wrote:

That  "someone else" was me... I split the LH auger gearcase trying to separate mine because I wasn't careful!

Marty

From the advice of another dealer, you have to heat the tube up to a dull red to get it off.

I just have a Bernzomatic propane torch that doesn't seem like it will generate enough heat fast enough to do this. Should I buy another, but a MAPP gas torch (which doesn't seem like it would be a lot more effective) or use this opportunity to buy an oxy acetylene rig?

I have a couple gear pullers and also rigged up some steel brackets so that I can apply pressure with a 6 ton bottle jack. So I just have to get it hot enough without annealing it.

Garandman wrote:

NEVER exceed 15psi pressure on acetylene. (Above that, liquid acetone is drawn from the bottle and will self-ignite.)

I use traps that keep the flame from possibly tracing back the inside of the hose.

But Mapp gas might do it. Great big might. It does get much hotter than propane. Tip choice can be critical.

http://abbysguide.com/ope/discussions/3542-0-1.html

http://www.cbs.state.or.us/external/osha/hazards/regbrnot.htm

http://www.tpub.com/content/construction/14250/css/14250_78.htm

If you have powerpoint http://www.dep.state.pa.us/dep/deputate/minres/dms/website/training/inventory/oxyacetylene.ppt

Oh yea, no oil or grease near the top of the bottles. Not on any of the fittings either. If they are rusty, leave them rusty.

Don't want you to go boom.

Home Depot has a Bernzomatic Welding, Brazing, and Cutting Kit  using MAPP and Oxygen.

"Kit includes burner wand, hose, oxygen regulator, fuel gas valvem cylinder stand, MG9 16 oz. MAPP® Gas cylinder, OX9 1,1 cubic foot oxygen cylinder, spark lighter and 5 brazing/welding rods"

$50. Anyone using one?

Garandman - I was able to get my auger tubes "cherry red" with the Bernzomatic Mapp/Oxy setup you listed above. I like it's portability & ability to get stubborn bolts & nuts off. I haven't used it as a cutting torch yet, but I am very pleased with mine otherwise.

Marty

Great, thanks for the feedback, the small size and quick setup suit m needs so I'll give them a try.

OK, I've got a torch, and I've slit the Rake lengthwise with a Dremel tool.

Now 'm ready to heat it and pull it off. I have a good-sized 3 jaw bearing puller.

But do I need more force, such as that from a vertical hydraulic press?

May be center drill the center of the shaft so the puller has somewhere for the point to go.  Put a good deal of pressure on the shaft, and hit the end of the puller screw with a hammer to see if it will break loose.  I'm sure you tried this, but I figured I would post it anyway.

There is a hole in the end of the shaft, I put a smaller bolt in it so the puller would have something to bear on.

Jeez,
You guys are scaring me......sounds like dangerous work.
Is there anything I should be doing NOW so I do not need to do this to MY Ariens snowblower a few years down the road??

Frank D.

Regularly do the grease procedure, take the shear pins out and rotate the augers around the shaft while putting grease in the fittings once in a while.  I'll do that sometime this season. 

Frank, what AJ says is Ground Truth.

Many owners faithfully lube the Zerks - you can tell because it's coming out the ends. But they don't rotate the Rake on the auger shaft, so it never gets distributed.

The other problems I found on almost every one I looked at was that the bushings on the ends of the auger and for the axle shaft are often badly worn. They're $3 each at a dealer. The auger bushings are easy, the axle bushings require knocking out a couple of roll pins.