Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

My buddy has an echo pb210e blower. it was running great and then just died. he put on a brand new carb this spring and it was running top notch then in the middle of blowing it just died. . he asked me to check it out for him so i said ok. it is getting pleanty of gas. the spark is a blue small spark. i figured it was electronic so i started to take it apart looking for the culprit. i found it has a coil and a cdi module. the module is $93 and the coil is $63 i told my buddy and he said to keep it or junk it as he is going to purchase a new one. any tips on how to tell which one might be bad ? its not worth replacing both parts but if i can figure which one is bad it might be worth repairing. also any tips on where i can get the parts cheaper ? thanks

since it has spark,  that should indicate the coil and module are ok, its a good possibility though the plug is bad.  i have seen several times where a spark plug would show fire when removed and grounded to the block, but as soon as it was put under compression it wouldnt fire.  try a new plug first, that could well take care of the problem.
Basicly you need 2 things for an engine to run, or at least try to fire, spark and fuel. and since you indicate its getting good fuel, try changing the plug.

I concur w/ Pony.  TRry that plug 1st.  For $1.98(beauty pageant ) you'll get your answer.   I've seen plugs black as coal and drenched w/ oil that could still put out a glee of hope spark when tested.

i should have metioned that i already tried a new plug. still has a weak blue spark.

Make sure that new carb is tightly secured to the engine. Could be an air leak...

Marty

the carb is tight. there is no sign what so ever that the unit wants to start. not a pop or sputter. the plug keeps getting wet so i know its getting gas. i also tried pouring a bit of gas in the cylinder and still nothing.  as i said it looks like the spark is very weak and a blue color. i think it should be more of an orange spark and a little more powerfull. any other ideas ?

Did you check for compression?  Maybe dirt got into the cylinder area and scratched that area.

Yep, check the compression next.  Also, look at the rubber fuel lines.  If they have a slight crack in them, it will be a bear to start and run.

bbwb

As mentioned, make sure that there are no air leaks. Also, I think mabie a good carb cleaning is in order. I would use Gumout spray, where goggles when using that stuff though. Then use a compressor or other means to clean out the remenants.

ok, i checked the compression and its ok. the carb is brand new and as clean as can be. the plug gets wet so the carb is squirting gas into the cylinder. how about timing on these things ? how do you check it and is there a chance it went way out and this is the problem ?

Here is another thought....take the rubber plug that goes into the tank out and look at the fuel intake line and the fuel filter.  I had a weed trimmer that had the fuel filter fall off of it and caused the engine to flood.  And again, if the fuel line has a slight crack or air leak, the blower will not run well or at all.  One last idea might be that the air filter is clogged and forcing the engine to run rich.  I assume that you have already checked this, but just my 2 cents worth.

bbwb

Look at the plug wire real good and make sure it's not screwed up.

Hey, you guys are killing me, I hope you have that thing running by now....  

1) timing is not off,  Timing is held with the flywheel key, the flywheel on the pb-210e is not heavy enough to shear or dislodge it.. (the big aluminum fan is the engine's momentum as it passes the compression stroke)

2). if it has spark, it has spark (try a non-resistor plug)...    as the chamber compresses,  resistance is increased due to the di-electric effect of the dense air .

3) if you have fluid on the plug, you are flooded (flooded very bad) even if you only pulled a few times on the starter cord.

4) I suggest a needle for the carb. ( metering needle)  The carb kit you need is a K10-wa&T...   The only parts you need to replaced from the kit are the gaskets / diaphrams and needle ( do not pull the welch plugs or screen)

     The kit can be purchased from aftermarket places for about $8

5)  IT is never the coil or the ignitor,   the magneto cdi system on echo and other small products are bullet proof ( they don't work hard enough to fail).

6)  Any torn or cracked fuel line should be replaced (the diaphram with the reed valve flappers does all the pumping of fuel into the carb, any brake in the into the line will cause it to suck air, not your problem right now.)

I suggest :1)  take the plug out,  with a compressor blow any fuel out of the cylinder throught the hole, pull the rope a few times and do this again to clear the crank case of any fuel.

2) use a pair of hemostats on the fuel line next to the carb to pich off the fuel flow.

3) install a good plug (ND BM6A or NGK W20M-U),  I have found that some Champion  Cj8's and RCj8's  dead from the box new, maybe 3 per hundred or so.

If it starts and pops normally after you release the hemostats, try cleaning grit from the carb/ metering needle.

good luck

friiy wrote:

i just found a pb210e blower that someone was throwing out.  i replaced the spring and pull rope and got it to start.  it idles pretty good, but when i give it gas it wants to stall.  i've tried to adjust the carb with the idle, high, and low screws but probably just messed everything up.  any help on how to adjust the carb would be great!  thanks!

Sell it to me ,  just kidding..

First try a new fuel filter (walbro part #125-527),  check the fuel line for cracks (inside and out of tank), fish the line out of the tank with a peice of bent coat hanger..

You may need to change the carb. diaphrams and inlet needle, (walbro part #k10-WA&T or K10-WAT)..

Don't give up on that blower, it is worth about $125 or more  as long as it runs and the handle is not cracked.

Good Luck.

Friiy.

PS.  You may wan't to check the high speed adjustment needle,   it has a "H" stamped on the carb body next to it, I think it is the lower one if you are looking at the front of the rewind.

Try turning the the jet needle screw 1/8 to 1/4 of a turn to counter-clockwise... it may just may get you by..

thanks for the advice.  as for the carb adjustment screws, what is the starting point?  when i first tried to crank it, nothing happened so i started turning and turning.  it still would not crank so i pulled the plug and found it was dry.  when i looked in the tank, the fuel line was turned up and not in the fuel (shoulda checked that first).  now the damage is done as far as the adjustment screws.  i now need a starting point.  should i seat the screws and back out 2 turns or what?  in the mean time, i'll take your advice and check what you suggested.  thanks again!

1 1/4  to 1 1/2   turns out is the starting point..

Friiy

Someone wrote that the correct rebuild kit is the  K10WAT.  In fact, it is the K20WAT.  The carburetor is a WT-409A.  If you check the listings of various parts sellers. you will see that the WT-409 requires a K20WAT rebuild kit.  I purchased a K10WAT and found that the gaskets and diaphragm were correct but that the supplied needle was way to big.

Now, a few questions:

The carb is stamped with the model number WT409A and also the number 814 elsewhere on the body.  I can find listings for WT409 but not WT409A.  Anywone know what the "A"  means?

There are orange plastic screw or screw caps for the high and low speed adjustments.  Are these caps?  Can they be removed?

My problem is that the machine will not run slowly and even when running fast tends to stall as if it ran out of gas.  I rebuilt the carb but nothing change. 

Check your throttle cable/linkage to ensure it's not partially applied.  I have a Stil brush cutter that was doing the same thing.  Running at operating speed as soon as it was started.  I traced the problem back to the throttle cable being twisted and opening the carb slide.  Also check to ensure your choke is completely dis-engaging.  That could cause initial higher engine speed then once warmed up, the choke will stall the engine.  Also look for water debris in your fuel tank & filter.  It could be causing the hight speed stalling.   

I know your frustration,   if you go to the Echo website ande look up the pb-210e model unless you use the serial number of the unit you may get the wrong carb part numbers,  The pb-210 and the pb-210e and the final model pb-210ep ( I think?) were made from early 1980s till 2007 June.

Every one of the carbs used for nearly 30 years was the WAT carb line...  there were "california emission"  (CARB act) pb-210ep's that were made for the last six months of 2007 that use that junk other carb. with the needle anti-tamper caps/ limit.  The first time I saw those on the blowers I thought someone had swapped it off a old junk ryobie or something.   99.95% of all echo blowers still running (pb-210 family ) use the WAT  carb.

If you plan on keeping the blower, change the carb. or order one of the newer junk kits and  keep it on hand .   Few shops  stock it, and anytime the blower does not run right...   the carb needs to be taken apart...( ether to adjust the needle or clean) just because the adjustment on the needles is so limited..

Check your fuel lines for small cracks, replace your fuel filter, look at your intake rubber boot for cracks (between carb/air cleaner housing), if no luck,  try to adjust your needle lever higher   (to allow longer needle open time on the metering diaphram and give you a richer mixture).

My mistake... there are some goofey units out in the feild with the weird carb.  you sould always check to see if your unit is one of the strange ones before you order parts.

Good luck

Friiy

Friiy wrote: 5) IT is never the coil or the igniter, the magneto cdi system on echo and other small products are bullet proof ( they don't work hard enough to fail).

Not quite true. I had no spark on my pb-210e that I’ve had since 1987. Talked to my local dealer who told me it was definitely the CDI or the coil. He suggested replacing both. (The CDI wasn’t made for a while, but Echo has recently started stocking them again.)

Fortunately, I still had the original receipt and both were covered under the original "lifetime warranty". Amazing in this day and age! I replaced both in about 20 minutes. Now starts and runs as if brand new.

      I don't believe that coils will "never fail",   I sold roughly 125 echo   pb-210 and the Pb-210e  a year for about 8 years qas a dealer..  (They were the most loved item by theives,  and if you ran them over with a truck they were done)....   I can not remember EVER having a warranty with a Echo pb-210 coil.  I have seen chafe the wire to the kill switch and ground out the coil, or break the inside guts of the switch to do the same... 

  I had maybe 10 to 15 echo's (blowers) in the shop at a time for repair in the shop,   I only kept one coil in stock for repair,  and only a used  for trouble shooting.   I would change coils for mech damage only, ie.. dog ate of spark plug wire,  dropped unit and coil is cracked...

I am just saying it is rare....be VERY VERY suspect if someone trys to sell you a coil for a problem..

Good Luck,

Friiy