Forum - BEST BUY And Sunday Parade

Carmine_Difazio

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #640 - 07/18/07 at 4:39pm

Hi JimB:

MacDonald's is a wonderful company. I've owned it since it went public in 1965 at $22.00 a share. I still do. In 1987, 100 shares of MacDonalds bought in 1965 for $2200, with splits, totaled 18,000 shares for one half a million dollars. It is a publicly traded company subject to very stringent SEC disclosures and a Board of Directors who account to internal and external stakeholders including the investors.

MacDonalds has built a trusted brand name with excellent products for money. It's stock price currently reflects the trust and pride its investors have in the company.

I don't see any parallels between dyson and MacDonalds. None at all.

We're discussing the dyson brand name not MacDonalds. MacDonald's is not at issue. Dyson is.

Carmine D.

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« Last Edit: 07/18/07 at 7:49pm by Carmine_Difazio »

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HARDSELL

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #641 - 07/18/07 at 4:54pm

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 07/18/07 at 4:31pm:

Hi HARDSELL:

Stick to the topic. We're not comparing a product to a brand name. The dyson name brand is the issue not a HOOVER Z.

I own a DC07 pink. I purchased almost one year ago from a major retailer. The product literature and carton make claims that are false and misleading based on the ASA dyson rule making decision.

What would happen if I return it to the retailer and ask for my money back?

Carmine D.

Carmine, when did you ever stick to a topic. I think you know my point. You are once again predicting doom to Dyson. I am simply showing that you are delirious as usual by showing that you predicted the Z to be the demise of Dyson. It still ain't happened just like you other predictions.

You should be like Paul Harvey and tell the rest of the story.

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JimB

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #642 - 07/18/07 at 5:32pm

Thanks for the memory Hardsell. I love old Carmine predictions....

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 10/19/05 at 9:07pm:

HOOVER does it again.

100 years and still going strong. Pure marketing and product genius. It's gonna WOW you!

Step aside vacuum lovers, make way sweeper fans, watch out breathless bagless, take note door to door vacuum sales, clear a wide path for the USA VACUUM CLEANER CHAMPION: HOOVER.

THe legendary name in floorcare does it again. It's going to knock out the competition.

Carmine D.

I bet Dyson is glad they have never had such high praise from this oracle. Although I did see a few Z's a the home depot this summer at a little over $300 off.

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #643 - 07/18/07 at 6:22pm

Hello guys:

There is a serious flaw in your statement of opinion about the changeover of the dyson advertising companies/locations accounting for the dyson product literature getting pulled.

It's customary for retailers to keep the old product literature displayed until the new is received to replace it. The old dyson literature and cardboard stands and holders are removed from the retailers I visited. There is no new dyson product literature replacing it. The retailers were told to remove them.

Just sticking to the topic at hand. Dyson brand name, false and misleading product claims, and revised dyson sales advertising, product descriptions and specs. Nothing to do with Paul Harvey and HOOVER Z. But I enjoy and admire both.

Carmine D.

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« Last Edit: 07/19/07 at 5:18am by Carmine_Difazio »

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HARDSELL

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #644 - 07/19/07 at 8:12am

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 07/18/07 at 6:22pm:

Hello guys:

Just sticking to the topic at hand. Dyson brand name, false and misleading product claims, and revised dyson sales advertising, product descriptions and specs. Nothing to do with Paul Harvey and HOOVER Z. But I enjoy and admire both.

Carmine D.

It has everything to do with Dyson. It shows your inability to forecast the doom of Dyson which you are attempting to do once again.

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #645 - 07/19/07 at 8:49am

Hi HARDSELL:

No, I disagree. You are interpreting my assessment of the impact of the ASA dyson rule making decisions and the recent aftermath by dyson and retailers as my prediction of the demise of dyson. I did not say it would be dyson's demise. Although since YOU say it, I'll would agree: It may very well be the demise of dyson as we know it. Time will tell.

What I said very clearly and simply is that it will have a negative and detrimental effect on dyson's brand name; dyson's credibility; and dyson's current and future sales. Why?

Dyson built a brand name on false and misleading product claims. It is trying to reinvent itself now. Why? The June 2007 ASA rule making decision which mandates that dyson can no longer use: NEVER CLOGS, NEVER LOSES SUCTION in its ads and product literature. Retailers and dyson MUST and have already taken actions to conform to the ASA rule making decisions for dyson.

I've said the ASA rule making decisions are a major blow to dyson. Like being hit from behind by a 2 by 4. Dyson never saw it coming. The consequences for dyson may/can be catastrophic: A class action lawsuit by the disgruntled consumers who filed the action with ASA against dyson; an increase in returned dysons to retailers by consumers who relied on the false dyson product claims to pay high prices for their dyson vacuum purchases; a tarnished dyson brand name; and a pervasive air of distrust by both retailers and vacuum consumers against dyson now and into the future. I asked: Can dyson restore it's credibility? And I answered: Not with words alone even technical, scientific jargon.

I said to the dyson fans and supporters, like you and JimB, who minimize and trivialize the consequences and significance of the ASA rule making decisions [and more importantly the severity of dyson's actions] that they are living in a huge state of denial.

I said that a dyson employee who posts on the Forum, Matt mmc, has been conspicuously absent about these matters.

Carmine D.

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JimB

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #646 - 07/19/07 at 2:16pm

Very entertaining the spin on this ASA opinion. It seems our resident Anti dyson crusader has taken it as gospel, a mandate, and rule making. Set aside for a moment the false claims that this european advisory group can mandate advertising rules in the USA lets look at the some actual words in the opinion that Carmine is touting and heralding.

Start of ASA quote-
"We understood that neither the pre-motor nor the post-motor filters fitted in a Dyson cleaner were used in the primary separation of dust and dirt from the air. We recognised that Dyson had intended the claim to highlight the difference between the filtration system of Dyson cleaners and that of other cleaners that relied on a filter or bag for the primary separation process; the clogging of that filter or bag would result in an eventual loss of suction.

We considered, however, that viewers were likely to understand the claim ... a Dyson doesnt rely on a filter so theres nothing to clog" to imply Dyson cleaners did not have a filter, which meant they could not become clogged, although we appreciated that this was not the message Dyson had intended to convey.

We noted the post-motor filter collected carbon particles and other emissions to prevent their passing into the atmosphere, but also understood that it did not clog and was designed to last the lifetime of the cleaner. We considered that with reference to this filter, therefore, there was no viewer detriment in the ad's suggestion that that filter did not exist and the phrase "a Dyson doesn't rely on a filter", in isolation, in relation to the post-motor filter only, was unlikely to mislead.

We also noted, however, although it was not involved in the primary separation of dust, and this was the difference that Dyson wanted to point out, the maintenance of the pre-motor filter was essential to ensure it did not become clogged. We considered, therefore, to state, without qualification, ... a Dyson doesnt rely on a filter so theres nothing to clog" was likely to mislead."

End of ASA quote

Carmine,
More to come, but I have do ask do you really want to tout this as something you agree with?

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #647 - 07/19/07 at 3:56pm

Hey JimB:

And you left out the final part of the rule making decision that says the dyson false and misleading claims ARE UNUSABLE!
That's the most important part of the decision! Like I said, where you stand depends oftentimes on where you sit.

The ASA is a rule making body for the advertising industry. The parties in the ASA dispute agree in advance to abide by the rule making decisions of the ASA. In other words, they MUST comply because they agreed in advance to do so. If the parties do not, as you know, the ASA can refer the offender(s), in this case dyson with its false and misleading product claims, to a body that can take legal action against dyson. So the result is that the rule making body [ASA] has the same effect as law. Are we in agreement on this my friend?

Carmine D.

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JimB

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #648 - 07/19/07 at 4:48pm

"The ASA is a rule making body for the advertising industry."
FALSE, the ASA makes no rules or laws. Advertising industry, seems intentionaly overbroad as they only look at UK ads according UK standards and have no bearing at all in the USA.
Furthermore your touted opinion states:
1) We understood that neither the pre-motor nor the post-motor filters fitted in a Dyson cleaner were used in the primary separation of dust and dirt from the air.
(wow)
2)We recognised that Dyson had intended the claim to highlight the difference between the filtration system of Dyson cleaners and that of other cleaners that relied on a filter or bag for the primary separation process; the clogging of that filter or bag would result in an eventual loss of suction.
(backing the guts of dyson's main claim)
3)We considered, however, that viewers were likely to understand the claim ... a Dyson doesnt rely on a filter so theres nothing to clog" to imply Dyson cleaners did not have a filter... although we appreciated that this was not the message Dyson had intended to convey.
(wait a minute the poster here says they found intentional misleading or was that claim intentionally misleading?)
4)We noted the post-motor filter collected carbon particles and other emissions to prevent their passing into the atmosphere, but also understood that it did not clog and was designed to last the lifetime of the cleaner
(Carmine touting a finding that the dyson hepa filter does not clog and is lifetime, wow.)
5)We also noted, however, although it was not involved in the primary separation of dust, and this was the difference that Dyson wanted to point out, the maintenance of the pre-motor filter was essential to ensure it did not become clogged. We considered, therefore, to state, without qualification, ... a Dyson doesnt rely on a filter so theres nothing to clog" was likely to mislead."
(so the finding is that the washable filter is not involved in primary seperation, and will not clog with proper maintanence, so as long as dyson more clearly qualifies that the filter need rinsing twice a year this ruling backs that it won't clog, pretty stunning Carmine would be touting this...)
embarrassed

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HARDSELL

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Re: BEST BUY And Sunday Parade
Reply #649 - 07/19/07 at 5:17pm

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 07/19/07 at 8:49am:

Hi HARDSELL:

No, I disagree. You are interpreting my assessment of the impact of the ASA dyson rule making decisions and the recent aftermath by dyson and retailers as my prediction of the demise of dyson. I did not say it would be dyson's demise. Although since YOU say it, I'll would agree: It may very well be the demise of dyson as we know it. Time will tell.

I DIDN'T SAY IT SO WE DO NOT AGREE!!

What I said very clearly and simply is that it will have a negative and detrimental effect on dyson's brand name; dyson's credibility; and dyson's current and future sales. Why?

I DISAAGREE AGAIN!!

Dyson built a brand name on false and misleading product claims. It is trying to reinvent itself now. Why? The June 2007 ASA rule making decision which mandates that dyson can no longer use: NEVER CLOGS, NEVER LOSES SUCTION in its ads and product literature. Retailers and dyson MUST and have already taken actions to conform to the ASA rule making decisions for dyson.

I've said the ASA rule making decisions are a major blow to dyson. Like being hit from behind by a 2 by 4. Dyson never saw it coming. The consequences for dyson may/can be catastrophic: A class action lawsuit by the disgruntled consumers who filed the action with ASA against dyson; an increase in returned dysons to retailers by consumers who relied on the false dyson product claims to pay high prices for their dyson vacuum purchases; a tarnished dyson brand name; and a pervasive air of distrust by both retailers and vacuum consumers against dyson now and into the future. I asked: Can dyson restore it's credibility? And I answered: Not with words alone even technical, scientific jargon.

IF RETAILERS WERE AS CONCERNED AS YOU PROJECT THE SLOGAN WOULD ALREADY BE REMOVED FROM THEIR WEB SITES.

I said to the dyson fans and supporters, like you and JimB, who minimize and trivialize the consequences and significance of the ASA rule making decisions [and more importantly the severity of dyson's actions] that they are living in a huge state of denial.

YOU HAVE SAID THIS AT EVERY OPPORTUNITY. FOR EXAMPLE: hoover fusion and 'z' WOULD BE DYSON'S DEMISE. A $300 DISCOUNT ON THE 'z' SOESN'T SEEM LIKE A THREAT.

I said that a dyson employee who posts on the Forum, Matt mmc, has been conspicuously absent about these matters.

SO HAVE OTHERS WHO HAVE PROVEN YOU WRONG SO OFTEN.

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