Forum - Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only

Carmine_Difazio

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #70 - 04/16/07 at 5:15pm

Quote from JimB on 04/16/07 at 5:02pm:

So they upgraded to a newer model, doesn't sound that odd. Also is that not typically about the same price difference for previous dyson exclusive launches into Sam's or Costco compared to an Animal model. It's not a price reduction it is just the appropriate price difference for the lesser amount of accesories.

Hey JimB:

Since you mentioned it, what are the differences between the DC17 Total Clean and DC17 Absolute Animal to make the price difference $70?

"NO." In the past when Sam's Club and/or COSTCO (and all the big box retailers) upgraded to a newer dyson model, it was ALWAYS at a price increase (most times substantial) from the previous dyson model's price. Never the same price. Just as all new dyson models have been at higher retail prices not the same price as the previous dyson model.

My sense is dyson and the big box retailers realize the dyson prices have gone up too high on the subsequent models and the reason they are sitting unsold on the shelves. Now, they are trying to ease them back down subtlely. That's a novel idea. And ironically the subject of many of the foregoing posts by the dyson haters. What do you know? The dyson lovers agree with the dyson haters again. Sounds like a marriage of the minds.

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 04/01/07 at 8:23am:

Quote from guess_who on 04/01/07 at 8:21am:

Hi,

I'd suggest anyone who'd like one waits until the price is down by a hundred bucks not only to get it cheaper but to send a message.

Venson

Venson, you're right. The price will come down. THe question is how: Fall drastically and/or gradually. Remember the DC11 and DC15. The DC15 dropped $100 in less than 6 months in October 2005. This was a red flag to buyers. Poor DC15 marketing resulting in poorer DC15 sales.

Carmine D.

Quote from guess_who on 04/01/07 at 9:00am:

Hi Carmine,

Indeed I do remember well. I especially remember a woman browsing in Bed, Bath & Beyond quite vociferously stating, "I'm not paying $600 for a vacuum cleaner," after she'd laid eyes on the "Balls" price tag. This contined to be very interesting to me as a couple of other female shoppers had taken note and a small congregation of three soon decided that what was important was "getting the job done" and that the job could be done for a lot less than the store was asking.

Though allowing sellers at least a chance to make the purchase a bit more attractive by slight falling way from the MSRP might merely be another sucker play that the consumer is the brunt of, it would encourage better volume in regard to getting the ball (pardon the pun) rolling saleswise.

Venson

Venson called it exactly right above. Dyson and Sam's Club are trying a "sucker's play" to bait consumers back to dyson with the DC17. Will it work? If it does, what does it say about the DC18 dyson light for $469? Even a bigger "sucker's play."

Carmine D.

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« Last Edit: 04/16/07 at 6:18pm by Carmine_Difazio »

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #71 - 04/16/07 at 10:38pm

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 04/16/07 at 4:58pm:

Hello Carl:

Here's a free vacuum history lesson to correct what you were told in error/misunderstood.

When ORECK broke into the vacuum industry in the USA many years ago (almost 50 now), it did not get a warm reception. Just the opposite. Many of the vacuum makers at the time compared it to a play vacuum because of its lightweight. To prove the worth and performance of his 8 pound ORECK lightweight (which was innovative at a time when most vacuums were almost 3 times as heavy on average), David ORECK set out to dominate the hotel and motel cleaning industries with his vacuum cleaners. That was a very bold move on ORECK's part. NO vacuum maker had ever attempted such a mass market takeover. If it failed, ORECK, in all probability, would have been history in the USA. Instead, what happened after wards is vacuum history. And ORECK has maintained the lock on the cleaner of choice at motels and hotels for decades (and now even household cleaning services).

Carmine D.

Quote from cprohman on 04/16/07 at 5:09pm:

That sounds pretty consistent with what I heard. Thanks.

Contrast the ORECK marketing/product strategy many years ago to dyson's 2004 tact with the DC11. When BEST BUY, SEARS and the "indy's" bailed out of the dyson DC11 canister in the Fall of 2004, dyson did a cut and run with the product in early 2005. Dyson didn't believe in his product and price. Not so with ORECK. Dave made a bold move because of his belief in his vacuum and his actions paid off then and still today.

Carmine D.

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #72 - 04/17/07 at 8:00am

Quote from old-timer on 04/16/07 at 5:10pm:

Hi Carmine,just to let you know something about oreck,real close friends of mine recently did a home and business show.They sold over 3500 orecks in 48 hours.
these guy's work for a northeast distributor,one of the biggest in the world.

Does T.L. ring a bell?

O.T.

Now that's selling that is believing. Nice 2 days work!

Carmine D.

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HARDSELL

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #73 - 04/17/07 at 6:52pm

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 04/16/07 at 4:58pm:

Quote from cprohman on 04/16/07 at 4:40pm:

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 04/15/07 at 9:59pm:

... Maybe poor performance and overpricing? Yes, of course, that's the reason ORECK's are used in hotels, motels, air-ports, and by all the nationwide household cleaning services. Poor performance and overpriced! I should have known. Thank you for clarifying this for me.

How much do hotels pay for the Orecks versus other consumers? Long ago someone told me that hotels used to get a much, much lower price than retail consumers, and that David gave the hotels the vacs at cost so that he could turn around and tout his machine as being used by so many hotels. Not a bad marketing strategy. Does he still do it? Or did he ease the hotel prices back up towards his retail over time?

Hello Carl:

Here's a free vacuum history lesson to correct what you were told in error/misunderstood.

When ORECK broke into the vacuum industry in the USA many years ago (almost 50 now), it did not get a warm reception. Just the opposite. Many of the vacuum makers at the time compared it to a play vacuum because of its lightweight. To prove the worth and performance of his 8 pound ORECK lightweight (which was innovative at a time when most vacuums were almost 3 times as heavy on average), David ORECK set out to dominate the hotel and motel cleaning industries with his vacuum cleaners. That was a very bold move on ORECK's part. NO vacuum maker had ever attempted such a mass market takeover. If it failed, ORECK, in all probability, would have been history in the USA. Instead, what happened after wards is vacuum history. And ORECK has maintained the lock on the cleaner of choice at motels and hotels for decades (and now even household cleaning services).

My sense is these entities buy from ORECK in such huge quantities year after year with quantity guarantees, that they are saving substantially from the MSRP. As they should and would in the real world of business. Wouldn't you expect this to be the case in business? I wouldn't doubt if ORECK gives these organizations a deal on their parts and repairs too. That's usually how businesses work and forge lasting relationships.

Carmine D.

Ford was the #1 selling car in the USA for years. That must prove that it is superior to BMW, Lexus, Mercedes and all other automobiles.

BTW, Hotels motels and airports always have dirty carpet.

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #74 - 04/18/07 at 9:18am

Quote from HARDSELL on 04/17/07 at 6:52pm:

Ford was the #1 selling car in the USA for years. That must prove that it is superior to BMW, Lexus, Mercedes and all other automobiles.

BTW, Hotels motels and airports always have dirty carpet.

As do cars and homes. Wink

Rugs can hold their weight in dirt and look clean. Daily rug vacuuming and yearly rug cleaning are highly recommended by all industry sources.

Carmine D.

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old-timer

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #75 - 04/18/07 at 10:18am

Hi Guys,heres my expert repair opinion on a traded in dc-07.The machine came apart to service it.

The good points.

No broken or worn out parts.

the brushbar as you call it,the brush bearings were loaded with hair and still spun.

The belts were still o.k.[the customer was told there were no belts in it].

The clutch still worked.

The bad points.
The brush housing and surrouding plastic all gouged from trying to get under furniture.
pre motor filter was never cleaned[did not know about it] was told it was maintaince free.
sand up in the H.E.P.A. exhaust housing,How did that get there?
Machine kept setting the bypass valve off,due to blockage.
4 out of the 8 highspeed cyclones were blocked with dirt,making the machine run hot and suction was cut in half,this can not be serviced by the novice,
hair wrapped up under the drive belt on the brushbar. when under power and on the carpet ,made a smell like burning hair.
Other than that it's not a bad machine.

and according to the Dyson experts this is the best of the Dyson uprights.

O.T.

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Carmine_Difazio

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #76 - 04/18/07 at 12:02pm

Hello OT:

All the findings (read: shortcomings) about the DC07 and statements from the customer about dyson vacuums are commonly repeated throughout the industry by the indy's I talk with about dyson. Please provide any other personal details to me by PM. Thanks for posting and sharing.

The cyclone configuration on the DC07 is flawed because the dirt falls to the bottom (smaller openings) and clogs. Bad design by the dyson engineers. Newton's law of gravity. Dah dyson! And the reason that the subsequent cyclones (DC14 and after) inverted the cyclones with the smaller openings on top and wider at the bottom. And the reason I prefer the DC14 to the DC07 (among other reasons) despite the lower air-watts rating.

I've stated before and worth saying again that CR should address the issue of user maintenance with bagless vacuums, particularly the most expensive brand in its consumer reliability ratings. Buyers and users are lulled by dyson and its retailers into thinking no maintenance and costs are necessary after purchase. Like most of the dyson written claims about its vacuums, this is misleading and wrong. I expect CR will take dyson on for this later this year. But have to wait and see.

Carmine D.

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cprohman

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #77 - 04/18/07 at 12:25pm

OT, your review sounds fair. Based on my experience I'd have expected a few of the sole-plate rollers to be stuck, too. You might check those. The fact that the owner didn't clean the pre-motor filter or cut the hair off the brushroll no doubt caused some of the additional problems you found. I suspect the clogged premoter filter decreased the air velocity, which in turn made clogging of the highspeed cyclones more likely. I personally have never experienced that with any of my units.

As for the sand in the HEPA filter, perhaps it entered throught the bypass? Alternatively, perhaps at times the pre-motor filter wasn't properly seated, allowly air and dirt to leak in around it directly into the motor. I have seen sand in the HEPA filters on my units, and I attributed it to the latter.

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old-timer

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #78 - 04/18/07 at 1:51pm

The cyclone configuration on the DC07 is flawed because the dirt falls to the bottom (smaller openings) and clogs. Bad design by the dyson engineers. Newton's law of gravity. Dah dyson! And the reason that the subsequent cyclones (DC14 and after) inverted the cyclones with the smaller openings on top and wider at the bottom. And the reason I prefer the DC14 to the DC07 (among other reasons) despite the lower air-watts .

Carmine D. [/quote]

Hi Carmine,this machine has the inverted cyclone set up ,real thin at the top and larger at the bottom.It must be a late model dc-07. I really cant see what difference it would make as to where the cyclones are located, inside out ,upside down, they still block over a short period of time. I quess the best way out would be to have more of them.?

O.T.

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JimB

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Re: Dyson Videos/Articles - for Dyson HATERS only
Reply #79 - 04/18/07 at 2:41pm

Quote from Carmine_Difazio on 04/18/07 at 12:02pm:

The cyclone configuration on the DC07 is flawed because the dirt falls to the bottom (smaller openings) and clogs. Bad design by the dyson engineers. Newton's law of gravity. Dah dyson! And the reason that the subsequent cyclones (DC14 and after) inverted the cyclones with the smaller openings on top and wider at the bottom. And the reason I prefer the DC14 to the DC07 (among other reasons) despite the lower air-watts rating.

Carmine D.

Oops, Interesting detailed analysis. Unfortunately once again in your zeal to condem the machine with 35% $ marketshare that you have inverted the Cyclones in your mind as opposed to the direction they are in reality. In the real world the DC07 has cyclones that taper off at the top. As you must know DC14 and others since have cyclones that taper off at the bottom but as you also must know the air both enters and exits on the wide end of the cyclone. DOH...

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