Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Hi all Just wondered if anyone knew of anything new on the horizon from SEBO? Will SEBO ever upgrade the X Series or replace it with a completely new model like the C Series canister was replaced by the D Series!? Thanks DC18

They believe they have a good vacuum cleaner w/the X series, so all they really do is change some features like the color.  And then that is not too often.  You know how often they add a model. When they added the the Fellix, they kept the X series uprights.  What they are doing is adding to their brand slowly, whereas someone like AB Electrolux adds models all at once.  That way, they can saturate the market w/their brand.

You will have to tell us about the new Panasonic lightweight upright.  It is competition for the VAX.

Hi DC
The current line up for 2012 in so far as new model launches was:

1. The Professional D commercial version of the D series cylinder vacuum.
2. The BS36 commercial upright which has improved ball bearings and a simpler controller floorhead fascia redesign.
   
3. The Sebo Felix Crystal (Germany only model which has Swarkovski crystals stitched into the main exhaust cover).
4. The Sebo Felix Royale (UK only model with the British Union Jack flag as the main exhaust cover.)
5. New colour/grey on the SEBO extension hose, spare part.
6. Full launch of the Felix/Dart charcoal filter for pet owners.
7. Full launch of synthetic disposable dust bags for Felix and K series.
   

Sebo are a private company, DC. Electrolux, Miele, Panasonic, Hoover et al - they all work to produce tons of vacs, often in different colours, under different umbrella companies all at once and then change over half way through the year to whatever one country got and reverse the launch process.(only exception is Miele who make all their own vacuums and don't sell a commercial line) They deal in both the commercial and domestic field, but also use other machines from other brands at times to make markets fuller depending on their ranges and their markets.

Sebo's main interest is really their commercial field. That's where they started before they eventually got into the domestic market. Sebo have recently updated their BS36 for 2012, with ball bearings on either side of the brush roll and a newer metal driven belt for longer life. The front hood fascia has also received a simpler design. The previous UK market G2 has been transferred to the U.S under the "Essential G" upright and Hoover's "new" U.S model, "Insight," is very much near to a Carbon, Chinese copy.

As for the X series, there is nothing yet on the horizon. I keep my ear to the ground with Sebo all the time as I'm fan as you know. The reason the X still sells is because it is a very popular machine and much cheaper than buying the commercial version under the Jeyes brand in the UK. Lots of hotels etc are now buying Sebo X uprights in their own livery as opposed to the cleaning contract companies who charge a fortune for the older Stealth, X1 Automatic based upright. I don't know if it is the same in the U.S for the Windsor brand versus SEBO U.S vacuums on pricing.

The Felix was launched as a separate upright vacuum with large hand held compatibility, very much in the same kind of design playing to Vorwerk. The bag is much smaller than that in the X series and gives consumers the opportunity to downside instead of having to buy the bigger X series. That is why both machines are still on the market; the Felix is no way a replacement for the X series.

As a private company you just have to wait. We'd all like Sebo at times to be like other companies where they constantly put out more designs than necessary but Sebo don't have the money for product launches - they're more interested in keeping what they have and trying to improve on existing components to make the design stretch - hence the X series will just keep going - and its a good seller, so there's no reason for it to stop production. Also Sebo want the X series to be as simple as possible - the design hasn't let them down, and yes, whilst it would be great to see a brush stop roll function and a variable suction control dial, like it is featured on the Felix, Sebo's data of their consumers' preferences lead the X series to be simpler and just do what its designed to do over the more complicated, lifestyle enthused Felix.

One aspect I adore about my X is that I find it faster to use than the Felix and it has that double thermal cut out function when something gets clogged, it shuts off automatically - the Felix and Dart don't have this feature.- but the Felix has the more modern features like the brush roll stopping if the hose is taken out by accident in floor cleaning use.

Despite the more modern feature, I've yet to come across any other full size vacuum I can push along with a single finger held under the grip handle on the X series.

Mike_W wrote:

Hi Mike_W Thanks for your reply, Thought I would ask if anyone knows any information in SEBO. I do love SEBO vacuums and find them effective at cleaning and easy to use and maintain. I've not seen the new Panasonic lightweight in person, but it has started to appear on UK websites like John Lewis, Comet etc... I think there is a few comments I've read about this model, one review not very good. The person says the hose is not long enough! There is another Panasonic model MC-UG614 another light weight upright see link below on John Lewis. http://www.johnlewis.com/231434182/Product.aspx Sure will be some competition for VAX and it Air range and the new Air Motion (not yet out!) DC18

vacmanuk wrote:

Hi vacmanuk Many thanks for you reply to my questions and updates on SEBO, most appreciated. Must get some of them synthetic dust bags for my felix (which I have had now for about 5 years, and still working like new). I certainly do, I'm becoming more and more of a fan of SEBO to, never thought I'd go back to a bag vacuum having used a well known bagless brand (Dyson!) for many years and would not use or try any other vacuum cleaner and thought they where the best (suppose they are for a bagless vacuum!) but SEBO has shown me another side. They are so effective at cleaning, the brush bars are so effective too groom the carpet pile. I'm just very interested and genuinely interested in what SEBO is doing and the new developments they have in the pipeline. It's nice to see they are a private run company (family run are they not?), just want more people to know about them and what excellent products they manufacture and produce. When I mention SEBO to people not many if any have heard of this brand. The people who have and the reviews you can read are always of a high regard for the vacuums. Before I got my SEBO Felix, the shop where I purchased the Felix from showed me both the X and the Felix. I nearly had the X but liked the variable suction and the function to power off the brush bar for hard floor etc...I should have gone with the X now I know more that it's just at home on carpet as well as hard flooring! Not that I regret having the Felix because I don't. They also showed me the bag in the X and how full and solid it gets as it fills (I was impressed) without really loosing performance! Like you say why change a simple and reliable and easy to use design like the X when it still sells very well. I want to get the X as I like the fact it has an instant wand which I miss having (I know I can get a wand for the Felix but it's the instant wand on the X I like). Plus I love the automatic height on the X to, it does look a fast vacuum to use compared to the Felix. I'm trying to convert people to SEBO and the benefits of having one and who they are as a brand! Thanks again for the info, let me know if you hear any new news from SEBO....I'd be very interested. DC18

Well, Sebo vacuums are used in large commercial venues, ships and clinics in the UK, as well as schools and hospitals. Says a lot really for the brand and they are getting more known now that they have updated their website. The American website for the brand have made fantastic videos showing off their products but the U.S are lucky to also have Windsor vacuums as well - our UK equivalent contract cleaning companies charge £500 for the X1 Automatic. If you don't require the use of a pet hair tool brush, get yourself a refurbished Sebo X1 Automatic - you're not really losing any real time performance if you choose the dark grey hood and light grey bodied X1 uprights that often appear on EBay UK,. The original white X1s have lower suction power with 850 watt motors compared to the 1000 watt motors on the grey/dark grey versions - and those ones last too. Older Sebo uprights are also pretty robust too.

How long has the D4 been out? Im thinking about ditching my riccar 1700 for the d4...

Thoughts?

The SEBO D4 came out in 2010.

Why do you want to "ditch" the Riccar 1700?

Well, if this link is anything to go by (http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/feed-resources/power-reviews/pwr/product-reviews/Canister-vacuum-cleaners/Riccar/p/681__99007304-1700.html) it shows that there is a common thread of complaint leading to the hose and then the power nozzle. The D4 is far better built even though Riccar go to the bother of suggesting that the belt they put in is Kevlar and lifetime. Seems to me that whilst Riccar (and I wish we had them in the UK as the uprights and canisters look wonderful) build good components, they're not good enough if these owners are suggesting breakages in 2 to 3 years.

vacmanuk wrote:
I was asking him why, because I wanted to hear his opinion.  He, being a vacuum enthusiast, probably just wants something new.  I know that this model is not even available in the UK and you admit it.  So, from your experience, how do you know about the Riccar 1700?  The 1700/1800 are very good canister vacuum cleaners.  There are going to be repairs needed for any vacuum cleaner.  Even SEBOs break down.  Are you telling me that there are only eight people, who have Riccar 1700 vacuum cleaners?

Again, I take peoples' reviews w/a grain of salt.  Notice how some say the machine is loud, quiet, hose short, cord too short, long cord, heavy, lightweight.  Hoses split, hoses didn't split, etc.

I love my 1700, but I wanna try something new... LOL I am always trading or swapping stuff just to get different things all the time and I am the same way with vacuums.. In all honesty, I'd probably keep my 1700 because its the first Riccar I've owned.. I usually always keep the firsts of something then swap the subsequent acquisitions...

With that said, I think the power nozzle is over kill for the rugs that I have. I'd enjoy the machine as it was intended more if I had wall to wall carpeting but I have 6 rugs and the rest of the flooring is ceramic, travertine or armstrong tiling. I wished the hose were longer, but that is because I vacuum my bedding because of my cats. I have a love hate relationship with the handle on the hose, so I wished the electrical connection to the hose wasn't integrated so I could put a non electrified hose on when I didn't need the wand/handle .. but that being said I love having the suction adjustments in my hand instead of the motor unit.

I guess I was used to my filter queen that had a custom 16 foot non electric hose... I guess I missed that setup because I rebuilt an older filter queen to add to my collection for that purpose.

What would satisfy me the most would be if the power nozzle was speed adjustable, or based upon the suction selected at the handle .. The brush roll is aggressive, and is perfect for installed carpeting... If it weren't for the cats, I wouldn't be so picky but I have to vacuum every day because of the hair and having the rugs get bound up in the power head is annoying... Especially when I am in a hurry.

jkbmmv wrote:
If you get yourself a Sebo D4 vacuum DEMO then you can try the vacuum for free - then you'd know if it is suitable - or any dealer near you who sells SEBO.. Alternatively, the Sebo Felix upright uses the same floor head as the D4 and K3 in the U.S. I'm not a rep but from what you're saying I don't think you should fork out so much money for a new vacuum - the D4 is pretty high in the U.S and it is a pity that the non-electrified versions are not on sale yet like the D1, or D2 we have in the UK (as well as the D4).

In so far as requiring a 4.8 metre hose (which roughly equates to your 16ft requirement). Sebo's canister vacuums have a length of 2.1 metres and I myself have used their 3 metre extension hose for cleaning out homes attached at the end of the existing hose. There is suction there but in my experience, having too much hose can be a bit of a downside as it is often clumpy, bulky and inclined to bang off doors and cause more damage than necessary.

I can't speak for Riccar as we don't have them in the UK - but the Sebo design is used in commercial fields, the brush roll isn't aggressive as you may like to think. Sebo also sell a delicate floor roller that can be swapped around for the harder bristle action, thus giving you more control and peace of mind for cleaning delicate flooring. However, I have ceramic tiles and mahogany floors and I use the ET-1 floor head with the standard brush roll and at times switch it off if I want - I haven't noticed any damage incurred in the last 6 or 7 years with the use of my Sebo. The beauty of Sebo though is that they also sell a motorised polisher head for delicate flooring, so in the future if you considered either the Sebo K3, Sebo Felix or Sebo D4, you could buy that polisher head as well and use it with any of those vacuums.

Sadly because of the brush roll and its power, rugs that are not fixed to the floor will clump up in any power head. I have yet to find any other vacuum on the market that can safely clean rugs with a moving brush roll - the only exception is the low powered cordless Gtech Sweeper where its brush roll isn't as fast and the bristles are soft. Generally suction only floor heads are better for portable rugs but even then you have to stand on them to make sure they stay down when cleaning.

Can't you buy a suction only floor head and just put it in lieu of the powered nozzle on your Riccar?

I see SEBO have updated there German Website, liking the new look! Lots of new pictures and features displaying there new domestic and commercial range (www,sebo.de). I mentions a newly developed parquet nozzle on the Premium Felix range! Not sure there a picture of it!? Like the pictures some showing close ups too! Good work SEBO.

DC18 wrote:
Yes, I posted this on another vacuum cleaner forum yesterday. The site also shows a new video for the D Professional commercial canister vacuum and there's also a new Sebo Felix Stars and Stripes as well as flag exhaust covers for Berlin, Germany and of course our own Royale shown.

In the UK, the K3 Premium now features the same 2100 watt motor as the K3 Vulcano and both come with the extra long hose. Pity that Sebo UK don't offer the ET-1 Felix floor head though as they do with the D series. Eventually it may well be replaced. As the owner of both, I much prefer the ET-1 to the auto rising ET-H - its older and slightly heavier.





DC - I just sold my X4 and X1.1 a couple of weeks ago and bought myself the older X1 Automatic. I did miss the original model and now that I have a virtually brand new (but obviously older X1) I now know why I missed it - it is a lot quieter than my X4 and X1.1 (not that these models are louder than the current modern high motor uprights out there) and heck, I can use my other machines with a pet hair turbo tool - the X1 Automatic makes a lot more sense for a daily driver, that's also lower in noise.

I think the new website for SEBO Germany is very good really like it, nicely laid out and informative. I'm still having a good look around it! Love the pictures especially the close up ones! So vacmanuk you've sold your SEBO X4 and X1.1 and now have a X1, I do see a few X1's on ebay recently. So your liking your SEBO X1 then? Sounds like you prefer it over the other X models? I'm looking at getting an X4 but still keeping my Felix. Like the idea of the convenience of the wand and hose on the X Series do miss not having a wand and hose combination on board. Be interesting to see what's new in the future from the SEBO stable.

I've tried and he won't get me a sebo to demo... He isn't interested in dealing with the line.. but after I started asking about sebo, he did buy a sebo X4 that a lady traded for a kirby sentria (dumb move I think) and thought that he'd sell it to me.. I told him I knew what he was up to and that it wasn't gonna go.. SO now he's stuck with a like new x4 that is just setting.. LOL Oh well I guess...

As far as the canister with the long hose, its nice to be able to do an entire flight of stairs without fighting with the canister, as well as clean my car out without having to drag the vac to each door.. That being said, I recently acquired a MD-S2 central vac canister that I installed.. Just had to pay for 2 new motors in it.. Talk about power... WOW.... That solves the 16' hose request cause now I have 30'... I'm using a lindhaus wide power nozzle with it. That lindhaus doesn't pull up the rugs as much as the riccar did. I think the Riccar is gonna go to Grandma for Christmas that way its still around if I ever needed it back...

I see in the latest Which Report that they tested a SEBO Felix and the filtration didn't score to well for allergen retention! Not sure why as I have a SEBO Felix Classic which I have had for 5 years now and can say you can never smell the dust from the bag and even the pet hairs now I have a dog! That is without the charcoal filter they now do and using paper bags not the new style ones and I have not got the fresh capsule in at present either! Not sure where Which are coming from! What was a very now surprise was one of my local big Curry Superstores now has a SEBO vacuum stand within the vacuum cleaner area, with a SEBO Banner 'We love SEBO'. They have a SEBO branded carpet mat and have on display the Felix Vogue and Pet models, the X4 Pet (which they had on display before on its own!) and the pet versions of the K & D Series (no hose or tube to test though). Least they now have a proper stand which was fab to see. Was quite surprised how light the D Series canister is! Would have loved to have seen more SEBO models on display but least it is a start!

DC18 wrote:
I actually sent my Dart to Sebo to ingest the smell of cleaning up after two Westies - they weren't surprised as they had had a few owners complaining about the smell of dog coming from their previous Sebo machines - this is why the charcoal filter was released. What model did they test? If they tested the Vogue model then it wouldn't surprise me as that has the basic filter and Which would do that intentionally, since their latest tests show a few discrepancies with even their favourite Miele brand models. I finally cancelled my subscription with them this year after being with them since 2009. I wouldn't really consider Which to know what they are doing - no matter how independent they are.

I've not really had any pet smells coming from my SEBO Felix to notice since we have a dog! The model I believe was the SEBO Felix 1 Premium - picture was the white and navy one! They gave it a best buy and strangely part of the cons was it noisy!! I don't find my particularly noisy! I know what you mean about Which! Will try the new style bags once I have finished with the paper ones!

jkbmmv wrote:

If you really want a long hose, why  not just purchase an extension hose.  This hose can connect to the wand-end of the handle hose.  Then you can vacuum w/o moving the main vacuum unit.

The only problem with an extension hose on top of the existing hose from your vacuum is having a vacuum that is powerful enough to contain the suction power right through/compensate for an extra hose to be added. My Numatic Henry 1200w just about copes with 6 metres of extra extension hose on top of its already long 2.5 metre hose - but it always has to be put in the highest suction setting compared to the lowest setting. Again it also depends on the actual vacuum of choice and its design - if it has sealed suction, very little leaks and air outlet valves are closed over, it's far more effective.

vacmanuk wrote:
The Riccar 1700 is a powerful machine.  Utilizing an extension hose, say 15ft., will not cause problems.  You would have to imagine that even if there was decrease in performance, this model would still have adequate power to finish a task.  This vac collector just wants the longer length to clean on his bed.  A power nozzle will not be able to be used.  Personally, I have used long extension hoses on weaker performing machines w/fine results.  A universal extension hose is acceptable for the Riccar.

Mike_W wrote:
Not use a power head on a bed? I used my Sebo ET-1 all the time for cleaning the mattress - not a problem there.

As for the Riccar 1700 - well, it it has a 1700 watt motor thus going by its name, then I'd still be questionning the use of a much longer extension hose on top of what it has. I say this because I have tried my own Miele S4 which has an 1800 motor - and turned up to the max, it struggles to keep up with strong suction and the 1.5 metre extension hose already added to its 1.8 metre standard hose that comes with the machine. Proof you can have the best machine in the world with sealed suction, but still unable to sustain the same power with a much longer extension hose attached on top of its existing design.

vacmanuk wrote:
Do not be so quick to try to find something wrong w/my statement, because you will only come to a deadend.

He would not be able to use a power nozzle on his bed or even to vacuum his rugs, because the extension hose does not have electric wiring for doing so.  Stop and think before reacting.  He has animals, I believe,  he probably is dealing w/animal hair, etc.  He most likely has a comforter, quilt, etc., which he does not want to wash every few days.  What some people do is vacuum them off.  He probably gets on the bed and makes his way around; vacuuming as he goes.  Now, think about vacuuming the same thing w/a power nozzle.  No, it is not going to work.  The material is going to get caught, plus the brushroll will wear the material faster than it possibly could on carpeting.  Why in the world would someone want a very long hose to use a power nozzle on the bed. Maybe if the bed was 15ft. high.  Believe me, there were a few times that I just used the upholstery attachment or floor brush to vacuum off an area of my comforter.  He is a vacuum collector like yourself.  Put yourself in his shoes.  He can do what he wants. 

As for the power from an extension hose, well, read my comment.  There would still be adequate amount of power to finish the task.  He understand extension hoses. He even said that he used a hose on his Filter Queen, which you failed to see.  You failed to recognize I even said I used extension hoses on "weaker performing machines".

I have used a vacuum cleaner w/a brushroll, to vacuum my mattresses regularly.  I have told people to do this for ages.  Some think they need a special vacuum cleaner to do it, but they do not.  They do not need to convert their Kirby to a handheld for mattress cleaning.  What I do, and tell others to do, is put the vacuum on the bed and start going over it.  No need to get on the mattress or stretch.  No need to take alot of time.  

As for the Riccar 1700.  I cannot figure out why someone in Scotland wants to tell the U.S. about our machines, which you have never used.  The 1700 has a 1700 watt motor?  Does that mean the 1800 has an 1800 watt motor. Does the Miele S2 have a two watt motor and the S8 have an eight watt motor.  For those who want to know, companies have chosen many different names which may have nothing to do w/the motor.

Mike_W wrote:
Do not even threaten me again. Just because you're the moderator as you plainly outline in all the posts you maintain does not mean others do not have the right to voice their opinion. As you retierate to "do what he wants," in reference to his status being a vacuum cleaner collector, likewise me and others who choose to offer a different opinion. If you wish me to contact powers above you again, you're going the right way - and this time, unlike so many other members who have left because of you I have the power to review your site and yourself.

I regularly vacuum my quilt and mattress with my Sebo power head - infact Vorwerk's videos on You Tube show that their nozzles can do the same thing. Maybe his vacuum doesn't allow the handle and a power nozzle to be used without the extension hose - my Sebo K3 does! I also have two cats. Rightly so, if the quilt has loose threads then it isn't suitable for a power nozzle, but then again if he uses a mini air driven turbo brush the loose threads are still going to be snagged up. Really if you wish me to present a video of me vacumming my quilt, top cover and mattress I'll gladly post a video just for you on You Tube.

I asked a question about the Riccar's motor. Nothing else. I would never dream about "telling" a member about a vacuum that I don't own - but I am trying to suggest that even with an 1800 watt Miele I found it difficult for the machine to cope with half a bag full of dust, suction max'd and an added extension hose on top.

vacmanuk wrote: Ryan,
There was no threat.  Believe me, if I were to make a threat, you would know it.  I do not need to make threats.  Again, you made a threat of what you would do to this site and me.  People would have to wonder why someone is here, who does not like being here.  Why would someone make a threat of writing a not so good review of a site they continue to visit. I cannot help what you do outside this site, but people really need to read this last post of yours and see your true colors.

Do  not worry about who is here and who is not.  There are still plenty visiting.  HARDSELL, for one, still visits here.


I always have said, and will continue to say, people can post comments here.  You, as a poster, have to be aware that others also have a right to debate what you are saying.  If you do not want anyone to debate what you are saying, then I would suggest that you create your own discussion forum or vacuum cleaner club.  That way, you are in control.  You see, when someone makes a comment, you in turn come back with a disagreement or correction. When I can come back w/a statement, you follow up w/ something like, "It's my opinion" and through negative comments about me or this site.  That is not going to work.  That type of behavior is done by children, when they do not get their way.  When they feel they are not "winning", they will say something hurtful.  It only makes them look like childish

Mike W
Moderator

As A dealer we have not heard of anything new but usually introduced in Feb at out annual show, but if not broke don't fix, still my favorite vacuum, however Miele S7 price and features now makes it a tougher sell

I wonder what SEBO has install for the coming year for 2013! I see in the UK they are becoming more prominent in Retail Stores than ever before which is good to see. I never thought I'd say this but I'm glad I've gone back to 'bags' after many years of being bagless! Lot less messy with a bag too!

In the US house current is normally 110-115 volts, 60 Hz. Wall outlets are normally placed on a 15 amp breaker for fire safety now that Romex and plastic junction boxes seems to be the choice of most builders. Appliances are limited to 12 amps draw, again as a fire safety measure, so figure 1380 watts as a practical upper limit.

Btw, Kenmore canisters soldiered along with ten foot long suction hoses on much less powerful motors than we are accustomed to today. If the data tags on the inside of their lids is to be believed both sealed suction and airflow of most of their 1970s products measured in the 30's for inches of water lift and CFM yet no one back then seemed to be worried about whether or not those old vacuums could handle four more feet of hose beyond the typical six footer. The ten footer was an extra cost option on any vac that didn't come with one and somehow those weaker vacuums managed the extra four feet without problems. I would dearly love to see a return of the ten foot vacuum hose.