Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Seen the new VAX line of bagless yet? better quality and performance?...at a far lower price.

Some say its stolen Dyson tech...some say its VAX xposing Dyson as a rip off [over priced] over hyped vacuum......that dyson is slipping[sinking brand]...that a dyson can be had at a fraction of the cost and with a warranty thats actually useable.......solved all the dyson flaws.....without the dyson shaft at the register. That VAX has zeroed in on dyson and plans to come at him head on.  If this is true ..then some drastic changes are due at dyson ....and another dyson [im a victim] lawsuit will come.......as always.

turtle1

Hi,

Also check out the "30th Anniversary Range" link at the UK website.

Venson

CarmineD wrote:

Yes.  However, more users prefer Dyson as evidenced by Dyson pushing Hoover into bankruptcy and pushing VAX out of BB.

You may also be interested to know that many users prefer Dyson over Oreck.

HS:

Your facts like you are skewed.  HOOVER and VAX are not bankrupt nor ever were.  They were both bought in arms length above board business transactions by TTI.  Why?  Save that for another discussion at another time. 

The issue here, as I see and said it, is not who likes which brand better and why.  I'm sure many current buyers and users enjoy their dysons and if they could would probably buy another.  Except of course you.  You liked your DC07 so much you sold it and didn't buy another new dyson.  Why?  You told us you don't like any dysons as much as a DC07.  Others here like you have said dysons are no better than any other bagless brands and not worth the higher prices.  Dyson has cheapened them and charged more.  [You went to a bagged instead.  Go figure.]  I'm sure there are lots of vacuum users and buyers like you and others who bought and used dysons and returned them for other bagless brands.  Or want to upgrade their dysons after 5-6-7 years but don't want to pay the higher dyson prices now vice when they bought.  These are the customers that VAX is targeting at the the big box rip off retailers.  

Now, research VAX refurbs on the internet and let me know what you find, if anything. 

VAX/TTI is on to something with their above strategy and that's dyson's jugular. 

Carmine D.

Hi Venson:

Rumors are circulating in the vacuum industry that VAX has enjoyed such huge success in the UK [dyson country] despite the economic malaise that TTI wants to add a new bagless VAX line in the USA.  The questions you raise are valid.  The answers are that we have to wait and see when and what comes out.  I have to think that based on the mediocre rug ratings VAX 3 and VAX 5 received several years ago in the USA that TTI will opt for a more USA rug/carpet suitable brush roll than the EURO.  And of course at less expensive prices than dyson.

Carmine D.

Venson wrote:
Howdy big V, i looked at the uk link.

Cant make heads or tails out of these,look like old hoover machs to me.The old vax's were old bosch siemens pieces that were sold at the box stores in the states.What a huge mistake that was.Although the girls in the advertising were not bad looking.

regards

MOLE

mole wrote:

Hello MOLE:

As you know TTI produced the FUSION and FUSION plus for HOOVER and the big box stores even before TTI bought HOOVER.  These were huge selling successes primarily due to their prices.  These along with the Mach's that superceded and the current line of VAX cleaners in the UK all share the same look.  The VAX name, history and past bagless products, including association with bosch/siemens, adds competitive clout and interest to a new bagless VAX product line in the USA market.  Again, primarily targeting big box retailers where customers are growing weary of dysons.  But never know, maybe indy models too, especially if the female models come with.

Carmine D.

"...Rumors are circulating in the vacuum industry that VAX has enjoyed such huge success in the UK [dyson country] despite the economic malaise that TTI wants to add a new bagless VAX line in the USA..."

Right. Here's a brief history of British Vax as it was known until the mid 1990s because as far as I can see the U.S website is a lot of marketing and not much history of the actual British company. In turn if you think having the Bosch/Siemens clout seems to add a gold like halo, think again; Bosch ceased the upright vacuum because it was unpopular, heavy and not reliable.

Right up until 1990, Vax were solely British and sales relied upon their canister vacuums that could wash carpets through suction only floor-heads that put wash solution into the carpet at the same time as sucking out the dirt. These became known as "3 in 1" canister vacuums, three things they could achieve ; pick up dry dirt and a large canister paper bag, pick up water and pick up the carpet cleaning function. These machines had been going since the 1970s and Vax were initially a door to door sales enterprise before getting in the main market. Their canister vacuum has hardly changed since the 1970s although they are now made in China, less well made and have lighter components making them better at lifting. They are still a bit of a pain to change over to wet function and because of their suction only floor heads a bit of a sore back in the making when sucking out all the water out of the carpet. Amidst the canisters Vax also went into production of carpet shampoos and some Chinese built cordless hand vacs and stick vacs started to appear. If you thought Dirt Devil's cordless Broom was their own design, think again - that design was actually by Vax and it wasn't a particularly well thought out cordless "vacuum" by any means.

Vax did try an upright vacuum but it was largely unsuccessful because Vax tried to put a water tank on it to make it in the same way as their canisters, known as the "New Wave". The tank leaked and on dry pick up only whilst the vacuum was okay at performance a lack of sales and some problems with plastic build quality rendered the model useless. We had a Vax canister for 19 years and it is still going, now given to a friend of mine who owns a shop and adores the dust capacity. However bought brand new it was solely used for washing carpets. Whilst it was good and better than anything on the market (Vax successfully won/ took Hoover UK to court over infringement and copying with their Aquawash canisters) at 12kg it's a mighty heavy old canister vac that due to its height fell over quite a few too many times.

Around 1990 Vax entered a partnership with Dirt Devil U.S brand as the UK brand of Dirt Devil was owned by another private party and had very little associations with the U.S company. As such Vax became best selling because it was churning out the paper pleated cone fitted cyclonic uprights and cylinders thanks to Dirt Devil - almost all of their cylinder and uprights have been Dirt Devil designs including the awful Swift uprights (I had one!) and this was based on what is currently selling as the "Dirt Devil Breeze" series.

Now their new 30th Anniversary models are exactly as Mole describes - they are the re-hashed Hoover Mach models and only differences are tooling and of course the name. Whilst I don't condone badge engineering, Vax aren't a particularly good company in my experience and their new TTi merger can only be of good news to keep sales afloat rather than be unique, which they once were thanks to their ingenious original canister vac in the UK.

Confusingly, Hoover UK also have a series of Dirt Devil uprights as their own models.

VacmanUK:

Do you know the VAX sales numbers/VAX percent of new vacuum sales per annum?  From perusing the internet, VAX models appear to be in all the major UK retailers with a larger presence than dyson.  What conclusions should we draw of the wider VAX product line availability?

Post script:  I don't see any VAX refurbs on the internet for sale.  What conclusion/comments should we draw on the lack of VAX refurbs for sale? 

Carmine D.

hey are in a larger abundance because:

1) Dyson were never a catalogue / home shopping brand but went head first into mass sales, a fact that is documented in Dyson's Book. Thus, Vax spares and models are high up in the catalogues and a proportion of UK buyers still prefer the idea of paying by week or monthly /Hire Purchase deals than buying an appliance outright. This is how Vax has become more wider known for buyers on a budget.

2) Vax are cheap and cheerful; they do their job and most models are cheap to buy and run and whilst they break easily; some customers wont think twice when value for money comes to mind and would probably buy another Vax again based purely on price; supermarkets here also sell a high proportionate amount of Vax models too.

3) From perusing the internet, visit www.ebay.co.uk Here are the current statistics:
For Dyson there are 917 vacuums for sale and in that list there are obvious reconditioned models or as you put it, refurbs also included.

For Vax the number is 856 which Im sure you'd agree isn't that far off from Dyson on Ebay.co.uk

For Oreck the number is far less at 217, Miele at 84 and Sebo at just 67.

Now for refurbs in the UK EBay is one of the highest sellers.

Frankly Carmine, you don't need rocket science to work out that despite Dyson being the more popular, Vax are also as popular and yet have a high proportion of refurbs on sale.

However I dont see why you need refurb info to assume that by having that data it necessarily points to poor reliability or otherwise?

http://www.which.co.uk/reviews/vacuum-cleaners

This currently shows that there are three models in the Vax family under Which? UK's consumer reliability records as being the best. No prizes for guessing that the ones featured just happen to be Hoover's Mach series, albeit TTi and not the previous Dirt Devils that Vax still sell, here in the UK.

Let's see if I can recap your data into a synopsis of salient points:

• VAX is a popular selling brand of vacuums in the UK and has been for 30 years.
• VAX has widespread availability in all the UK retailers.
• VAX models rate highly with WHICH?
• VAX is marketed to the budget minded and frugal consumers as an alternative to higher priced vacuums.
• VAX is reliable and worthy enough to warrant a substantial resale market in refurbs rather than meet with a junk dump fate.

In summary, as a mass marketed and sold vacuum brand VAX competes equally on all accounts with the bagless brand that is the UK icon and in first place for yearly new vacuum sales.  As well, as Electrolux which is in second place.  Did I miss anything?

Carmine D.