Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Thought the Dyson discussion board would be interested in reading a small article about the Tacony Museum. Also Carmine's old friend.....

http://www.stltoday.com/blogzone/hit-the-road-jack/hit-the-road-jack/2009/08/new-museum-opens-at-st-james-on-historic-route-66/

mole wrote:

Very true MOLE. 

• Firstly, indy's don't sell defective products because they know the good ones from the bad, unlike big box stores and their buyers. 
• Two, indy's stand behind the products they sell, so customers don't have to pay extra for an insurance policy [aka: extended service plan]. 
• Three, if indy's sold defective products, with worthless warranties, and didn't stand behind their sales, they wouldn't stay in business very long. 
• Lastly, the indy's are the back bone of the vacuum industry.  Just ask James who is repairing his defective products in/out of warranty that require big box stores to sell ESP's to insure the customers' product purchases.

Carmine D.

Perhaps an independent could explain what they do with returns and whether they have to absorb the loss.    My understanding, which could be wrong, is that big stores like Walmart have the ability to dictate terms to manufacturers and the manufacturers share in the cost of returns.  Presumably, an independent has less negotiating power due to smaller volume.  I would assume that a return is repaired if necessary and sold as a used vacuum, possibly at a loss.  Any comments?

Hi Severus:

Excellent points with good questions. 

I can't speak for all the retailers.  Too many.  All retail chains, even stores within the same chains, have their own procedures.  Depends on the volume of their sales and volume of their returns and the terms they negotiate with the maker.  Several years ago, a VP for TARGET claimed vacuum returns were it's highest return cost item.  As a result, TARGET stores contracted with Indy's to buy up the vacuum returns in order to defray the high costs of new vacuum returns.

WRT Indy's: They eat the loss on straight out returns for refunds/credits regardless of time passed.  Some charge a restock fee up to 20 percent, if still under warranty, and working properly.  But the customer returns it dissatisfied.  The indy's, if they are authorized dealers, get a rake off on the makers' parts and have to repair/re-sell as used.  The Indy's can't give a maker warranty on the resale but have to warranty the used product at their own expense.  The proceeds of the used product sale are equal to the product sale's price plus the restock fee received minus all the costs of sale including any warranty repairs after the sale.  Double, triple, whammy.  Lose the new product sale, have to invest additional time, effort and money to resell the product as used, and have to warranty at their own expense and eat the warranty costs of repairs.  If the Indy isn't authorized by the maker, it has to scout around and find the best prices for replacement/genuine parts which diminish the products' profits on resell.

Hence, the reason indy's are particular with what they sell, why they sell it, and when they take it back and why.  If they sell high priced junk that fails to please and/or iweak performers, they inevitably get the products back.  Huge headaches costing more time and/or money to resell.  This is the predictament that many Indy's faced with dyson's DC11.  A lemon.  Dyson forced these on dealers as part of the dealership franchise.  When these lemons came back, Indy's had to suck it up and eat the losses. 

Carmine D.

Severus wrote:
The funny part of it is, manufacturers DON'T have to KowTow to BBS... they just do. Lured by fast profit they think they are negotiating from a weak stance and the BBS, promising huge numbers, have the upper hand. If manufacturers believed in the POWER of their own RELIABLE BRAND NAME they could dictate to the BBS and both could make money instead of losing money long term.

Lucky1 wrote:
Hi Lucky1,

Believe me, I wholeheartedly agree but I do not have that much faith in the makers of a good part of what is on the market. They've got quick, easily acquired profit on their minds and it is obvious in craftsmanship. Sadly, I think it remains all about buy low/sell for the highest the market will bear.

Besides which, what's to buy? How many vacuum makers are investing time in putting out product that is solidly theirs? Who even designs and makes their own PNs or tools any longer? Most of that kind of thing is coming from the same place. Only the names stamped on it are different and if that in the end is the only difference then a savvy shopper can do well for his or her self without worry over having to play the "name game".

There are NO vacuums in the higher price ranges as of late that I believe or even feel might match up to the price asked. As for the lesser priced, I think you buy and, reasonable care considered, may have hope for the best for your buck. The bargain lies in a decent price affording four or five years of use with minimal problems and good performance.

Venson

Venson wrote:

HI VENSON

Point well made and i agree....even tho i work at a shop , ive yet to see the same match ups. .....above $500 i see no difference  vs a $1000 unit to be honest.  Ive worked on a couple thousand vacs in my very short time....but not all...and have yet to see where the xtra goes. But have seen orecks-hoovers-panasonics-riccars- trash many who cost far more and last 15 + years.....i guess im still wet behind the ears.....a long way to go.  But i really feel  that with the right vac shop you cant/wont go wrong....theyll adress your needs/price and show whats gonna work/do best for you and back it up 100%...in writing and a hand shake...like we do. i love what i do...and was trained/worked with a great man...a vet of the business....i learned to be quiet and listen/watch from the best...and his words were the same as yours...with proper care and service a vacuum will last many many years in most cases ...despite the price.
turtle1

Severus wrote:
Hello Severus,

You're right when you say box stores (not all mind you) have the luxury of sending product back to the manufacturers. It's one reason why many times when you buy from a box store you see a bright piece of paper in the box that states if you have a problem with the product DO NOT return to store but call the manufacturers hotline instead.  The suppliers don't want product back so they'll either troubleshoot over the phone or have you take it to a warranty center if possible.  We rarely go more than a week without getting customers from Wal-Mart or Best Buy asking for help either putting machines together or asking how exactly everything works.

As far as product we sell goes all circumstances are a little different.  If a product is defective out of the box it goes straight back to our supplier and we receive a new piece.  If the customer returns product after a week or two and it's still in new condition we put it on the floor as a demo at a discounted price with full factory warranty.  I have never had a problem with any distributor we deal with not honoring the warranty in such a situation.  If the machine has been banged around and looks like someone needed a garbage truck rather than a vacuum we take the cost of a service off the refund price, service the vac and sell the machine discounted with factory warranty.  Having said all this, our return policy is 30 days and in general most machines aren't used more than a half dozen times at best. I can also count on two hands the amount of returns we take in a year as if we do our job properly and listen to what the customer is wanting there should be no reason for anyone to bring anything back. I should also mention all of our refund policies are mentioned up front and printed on our receipts to avoid any problems should a return be needed.  Keeping customers informed and in the know is the most important thing we can do.

Dusty

CarmineD wrote:
Hey Carmine,

Remember CatLady and the vacuum professional that would not do her right?

I named one.


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

Not quite, DIB.  She got a brand new MIELE!  Try again.  3 strikes you're out.

Carmine D.

Hello Dusty:

Did you carry and sell DC11 canisters?  If so, what were the results?

Carmine D.