Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Carmine,

Come-on pick up your speed!  I through out the challenge already and you have not answered it...  The Challenge:  If a 9” nozzle is undersized as you and others claim, then by how much? - How much longer (time) would a 9” nozzle take to a clean a home or room? - Why don’t you vacuum any one of your rooms and post the time it took to vacuum.  Then tell us how much longer the highly maneuverable Dyson [F1] nozzle will take to clean the same room.


DIB

The real challenge [which you gloss over/miss] is to explain/justify a $250 price drop on the latest DDM DC22 pricing by ABC Vacuum Warehouse before it's even intro'ed.  If I recall you posted here MSRP of $700-$800.  What happened?  Didn't you strenuously object and take umbrage when I posted a different price range and you asked my price sources.  Back at you, DIB, with the facts not opinions.  I was correct, just in the wrong direction.  Down rather than up.  Not a good marketing message coming from your home team company.

Carmine D.  

DIB,

You can't go by speed but area as people vacuum at different rates of speed. The more area covered per required stroke lessens the time. If the rule for thorough vacuuming is four strokes per square foot by use of an upright or canister with a working brushroll do the math. (Don't take my word for this do search for carpet makers' cleaning recommendations.) If nozzle width is 12 inches, hypothetically it should only takes two slow forward passes plus two slow backward passes to do a decent job. If the nozzle is 9-inches wide then you need 8 overlapping passes to constitute the estimate for thoroughness per square foot.

What has not been discussed is that 9-inch or 12-inch, the PN's active cleaning area has to be factored in. The little Dyson nozzle appears to be lacking maybe an inch-and-a-half of active cleaning area which then would be 7.5-inches. A good PN or upright might allow for one-fourth to one inch of inactive area still allowing far more cleaning area per stroke.

Venson

PS --- By the way the diagram of the swivel neck is not pertinent to the conversation. We were discussing nozzle connections that can pivot up and down and swivel side to side.

I forgot to add that vacuuming is still a labor intensive job. High suction, good brushrolls and even self-propulsion may help but the more you rush the job, the less efficient you are no matter the brand of choice.

Another thing -- so far the adverts I've seen for both Dyson and Miele's uprights with swivel capacity is that the demonstrations are silly. How lazy is lazy? They depict people vacuum around light dining chairs, pet bowels on the floor and all sorts of other nonsense.

If you call yourself making an even near adequate cleaning effort, you pull out dining chairs one at a time as you work and put each back after you've cleaned the spot of floor it sat on. This good because it assure that you've got at grit immediately under the chair legs if your doing a bare floor or "groom" the carpet in that area to help keep depressions from forming on carpet pile.

If I only cleaned the parts of me that show, I guess I'd never wash my rear end -- and wouldn't that make the world a lovely place?

Venson

Venson,

I “get” that there is a “best way” to vacuum carpeting.  I say, 90%-99% of the population does not know, nor care to know the “best way”.  This Dyson nozzle can move as slow as anything in history and has a user [demand] benefit others do not have...  it has an “extra gear” that is - it turns into, thru, under, around, changes directions, moves along side contours and obstacles better, faster, easier than anything on the market or maybe in history.  If users want quality suctioning (slow deliberate strokes) the DC22 can do it.  If users want “an extra gear” the DC22 can do it and no others can.  Compared to the slow development past, this is a radical change and out-maneuvers anything and is exclusive only to Dyson.


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:
DIB,

No, no, no . . . sorry you're not getting off the hook. Your initial question regarded the time difference possibility between cleaning with a PN that has a narrow cleaning swath as opposed to one with a wider cleaning spread. I stated that the time frame varies as each of us have our own "speed" for vacuuming. However, the narrower the nozzle the more strokes you make to mange full coverage even if you do a sloppy job.

As well, I said nothing about proper "suctioning". What I intended to convey is that a vacuum with a revolving brush plus good suction needs x-amount of time to do its job properly unless your prepared to spend money to just skim the top of your floors, rugs and carpeting for surface litter. This applies to vacuums of all brands, types and price levels.

Also the "extra gear" you're speaking of is a called a universal joint and does not apply to this nozzle.

Venson

It appears that the DC21 is going away soon; many online retailers are labeling it as discontinued. I wonder if this may change the pricing of the DC22 and DC23, and if the DC23 will finally hit the mass retailers (it's now listed on BestBuy.com).

iMacDaddy wrote:

Hi iMacDaddy,

I checked out the BestBuy site and the DC23 is listed but on back-order. Price is $600. The DC21 will still be around for a while. I did a search at pricegrabber.com and found refurbs for $310 and new models for $500.

Venson

Venson wrote:
Venson,

What’s your motivation?  To bad mouth the DDM DC22 Motorhead only or prove it’s inventions are not improvements?  Can you prove out, not just throw out red-herrings?

Patent offices do not give patent protection for in the public domain u-joints (your descriptor of the DC22 Motorhead’s power nozzle).  Dyson thought of an entirely new way to use a u-joint... to rest it on top of rolling pivots (3 wheels).  His nozzle out-steers anything on the planet and it looks like Dyson already “owns” the pn steerable segment too via his patent protections.

DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:
Hi DIb,

You asked a question and I gave a direct answer -- I thought -- and now you've hopped on some tangent about steering. There's little importance as to what out-steers what. We're not talking the Indie 500 or a slalom course just getting a clean floor. You've wasted your time and mine.

Venson