Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

My Niece has just taken a job selling Rainbow vacuums door-to-door.  She is currently on a crew and observing, but wants to do a demo for me this Saturday.  She knows that she is coming into a "Kirby Home" and wants to experience a difficult customer.

I have already warned her that in this economy I pitty her trying to sell a niche vacuum with a price tag of $2,800; and with my aging washing machine about to need replaced even if I were interested,  there is no way on God's green earth I will buy from her.

She is fine with that, but wants me to help her out, so I turn to my experts for help.  I saw a Rainbow demo--OK--30 years ago.  What are the new machines like?  I know my Kirby has changed since then, I have a paper bag now.  Do they, Rainbow,  still push the clean air over cleaning abilities?  I just want to know what to expect with the new machine.  I am supposed to be difficult, which I will be, but want to be somewhat prepared.  Her trainer will be with her, and he is going to help her overcome my objections so she can learn to sell.

MOLE--  I need your help

Carmine--Come on man, I don't want to have to give this girl gas money.

Hello Just:

You're a good man and Uncle. I am the easiest person in the world to sell.  And even worst with family members.  My feeling is if you are going to get taken, it might as well be from a family member.  I'd let her do the demo.  It is a good learning experience for her.  I'm sure you will be kind and charitable.  When she's done with the demo, ask her what's the best and final price you can get it for.  She'll consult with her mentor and give it to you.  I suspect about $1700 will be the price.  Buy it!  Chalk it up to assisting a family member in a time of difficulty. 

If you say no to your niece now, you will undoubtedly short circuit her future sales career.  I don't think you want to have that on your conscience for the rest of your life.  When defeat is inevitable, accept it graciously.

As a Kirby fan, I have no doubt you will find owning and using the Rainbow a fun and rewarding experience.  And the family will talk about it for generations to come. 

Carmine D.

Thanks everyone,

I have warned her about selling, especially in these times.  There are currently 17,000 aircraft workers out of a job here in my city so it will be harder to sell than ever.  A friend of mine in the car business said it is so bad that they are sending brand new cars to the auction just to move them off their lots. 

I am going to let her demo for the experience, but she knows it will be a no sale.  She may think I'm a pushover, but my checking account says I have been pushed to the limit.

Mole--I had forgotten the Machine of Tomorrow, Today slogan.  I have a Rainbow in my basement dating from about 1974, I think I gave $150 for it used.  If I wanted a newer one I think I would try the newspaper, Craig's List, or Ebay first.   The carrot?  She gets $30 per demo for the first two weeks of training, then she is strictly commission where she will make--get this $200 per machine (crooks). 

Carmine, I think that's why they have them push to family and friends; because it's harder for them to say no.  They just need to push to family that has money and a washer that isn't teetering on the edge death.  

I take it that they are still using the light show with dogs and ponies.  It will be fun to watch. 

No doubt family and friends first.  But I hear that's how the feud between the Hatfields and McCoys started.

BTW, a friend who married about the time of your Rainbow, bought a new one shortly after he married.  He and his wife divorced after a few years, but he brags that he still owns/uses the Rainbow which outlasted his wife/marriage and is still going strong. 

Carmine D.

I doubt that it will be fun to watch.  Rainbow will be very stingy about giving away the $30 per demo without a sale.  If you don't buy, I suspect the sales manager and your niece will have an unpleasant conversation.  I suspect the sales manager will give you the hard sell as well.   The sales manager gets a big piece of the pie if you are converted to a buyer.  I hope I'm wrong...





Just wrote:

Severus wrote:

I agree with you Severus.  Here's my best guess:  Assuming the Rainbow price is $1700 to Just and $200 goes to Just's Niece, this leaves $1500 profit to divy up.  The Rainbow costs IMHO about $700 [product cost plus overhead added] to the branch sales office.  The branch manager and sales manager will split the $800 [$1500-$700] at $400 each and/or some variation on 50/50 depending on the business arrangement between the branch and sales manager.  Just my best "best guess" on the dollars and numbers.  I'm sure if Just's Niece knew this information, she may feel differently about demoing and selling friends and family.  But, as the good college Professor told the marketing class many years ago, there is money to be made in sales.

If Just wants to be hard nosed like the sales manager will no doubt be, he would ask all the parties in the transaction chain [after the Branch office cost] to lop off 50 percent of their take: Niece gives back $100 on the price and the Branch/Sales Managers give back $400 on the price.  That brings the final Rainbow price to $1200, if all are willing.  Just has to be so inclined at that price, to help out his struggling Niece, and take the Rainbow water plunge too!  If the parties are unwilling, Just declines the sale at the price offered and says he wanted to buy, but they could not make the deal attractive enough for him.  No offense to his Niece and no umbrage taken by any.  

Carmine D.

Carmine,

You either have great confidence in my nieces selling abilities, or my lack of resistance.  She is doing the demo to get the $30.  There will be no sale at my house. 

I agree for the not $1,700 asking price but $2,800 the machine may have cost them $350 to build.   When Carl and Jean had the old Air-Way vacuum store on Douglas here in town, this would have been 1981 or so; he told me then that the $598 Kirby Tradition cost about $125 dealer cost and he figured that at 100% markup from the factory.  Each middle man doubled the price.  Factory+Distributor+Dealer=$598.   

I once had a salesman, Fairfax, tell me.  "You obviously cared about getting rid of the dirt, that's why you bought the Kirby."

"You are absolutely correct" I said "That's why I'm keeping the Kirby too"    NO SALE!!

 And, And, And besides. Like Mole always says "for the price they are asking for this machine, I could have a Central Vac installed."

Hello Everyone!

Carmine will remember me ( I hope!) from the old and now defunct vacweb forum.

Despite my nearly becoming a Kirby distributor three times, and being the local branch manager for Electrolux the last four years it was an American vacuum company, the vacuum I have owned and used for the last 16 yrs is a Rainbow D4. I have replaced the hose once, the brush roll four times, (every three years) and the belt once a year. The darn thing works. It just works like nothing else I have ever tried. Dog hair, dirt, whatever, it just keeps working. It is most definitely NOT a lazy man or woman's machine. I avoid the separator cleaning issue by having three spares, so I slap a clean one on when I am finished, and place the used one in the top rack of the dishwasher. I have removed many many pounds of dirt from my home. The water is now just cloudy after vacuuming the entire house, and has been for years. Just for oneriness I let aKirby salesman in kept mum about my prior experience and vac knowledge. He called his boss to tell him I was not buying because I had no dirt. That poor kid got reamed (I could hear his boss yelling at him) He old him he was quitting and calling someone to pick him up, and he could get his POS machine himself

Hello Just:

Selling has become more sophisticated than back in the day.  What do you say/do when your dear Niece says to you: Uncle Just,  you know you can save over $1000 a year by forgoing that daily cup of coffee at your favorite haunt each day and brewing it at home! 

Hi Trebor:  Ah the good ole days!  Glad to hear from you and about you.  Be well.

Carmine D.

Well my Niece came over this weekend.  She made a few mistakes, or at least what I would call mistakes in the selling game.  First she was 26 hours late for her appointment.  She was supposed to be here on Saturday at 2:00, she finally arrived on Sunday at 4:00 with boyfriend and baby.  I won't fault the onlookers because she was family.

As for the machine, and I hope I don't insult anyone.  I was very underwhelmed with what Rainbow has become.  I have an very old D2 model that is metal and built like a brick outhouse.  this thing was plastic.  The body was plastic, the tools were plastic, even the seperator is now plastic.  It was quieter than my older Rainbow and like the poster above she couldn't pull any dirt. 

First she did the bright light and scrubbed it across my carpeting--No dust.

Then she had me get my current machine, a Kirby Ultimate G and turn it on.  She shined the bright light on the bag--No dust.

Then she put a black cloth in the hose of the Rainbow and scrubbed around on the carpet--It didn't clog.  She thought she had torn the cloth so she went to change it she hadn't there was just no dirt.  So she scrubbed around on the couch--ditto.  Then she movd out the couch and cleaned behind it--no dirt.  So she put on the powerhead and vacuumed the entire living room paying close attention to make several passes by the door--she got a little fluff all in all about the size of a quarter.

She called her boss and told him she was finished and I wasn't paying $2,596 for this machine even knowing if I gave them 10 of my friends names I would get the Rainmate for free.  Then he offered to take $400 off for my old Rainbow.  No deal

I told my niece that they needed to provide her a little more training on the machine itself and not just the mechanics of the demo, as she had no knowledge of the seperator which is the heart of the machine.  She didn't know about the digital brushless motor, and she didn't know about the post filter.  I was invited to an open house where I could "earn" my own rainbow on Monday--I didn't go.

So you are Aunt Just, not uncle Just?

Carmine D.