Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Here is the link to the UK Advertising Standards Authority, about Vax's "No Loss of Suction" claim.

http://www.asa.org.uk/asa/adjudications/Public/TF_ADJ_45100.htm

mole wrote:
Mole,

I know that you know your business.  I do question you (and others) cheerleading the profit gutting, innovative slothful and communist sponsored TTI for going after a person or a manufacturer you loath (Dyson), when it can be your products and good paying American jobs next (loss of jobs or pay cuts).  Can you explain otherwise?

I want an answer from Mole only please.


DIB

CarmineD wrote:
Carmine,

I am familiar with brilliant people who are not financially successful.  George Washington Carver and Nikoli Tesla are such two.  They had no personal wealth, yet their God given ideas brought super wealth and gain to the world.  Those who choose to leave nothing of any real value behind (doing Gods work), well the Book reserves no praise for such as these.

I enjoy posting the “B” word and for many reasons.  Demonstrating a contrast; weekend quarterbacks who look backward with 20/20 vision, versus visionaries who look forward with faith that’s always followed by profits (good and honest gains, both directly and indirectly).

I will adjust my dollar value I put on Dyson’s creation; “No Loss of Suction”. - Perhaps up to $500m invested overall.

Those who bring something from nothing should fight for what began with them, always!


DIB

mole wrote:

Hi MOLE:

You're right again.

Dyson was floundering for years since 1979 with the 5,174 dyson prototypes.  It's was the royalties and compensatory fees [over one million $] from dyson's former American licensee for patent infringement after the breakup of their business relationship, that provided the seed money to build dyson's Malmesbury UK plant in 1992.  Not profits from vacuum sales.

Then, dyson's compensatory fees from the legal suit with HOOVER for patent right infringement [$6.3 MILLION] provided the seed money to build the Malay plant in 2001 and produce/export vacuums to 50 countries worldwide.   Not profits from vacuum sales.

BEST BUY's management convinced dyson to launch in the USA in April 2002.  Dyson wanted to postpone the USA market by several years but instead listened to BB and launched early.  Smart move by dyson to follow BB's advice.  Lucky too, dyson did.  It would have missed the vacuum money train from 2004-2006. 

Of course, the interviews and press releases with all the accolades and praise never tell the story within the story.  Readers including dyson enjoy the simple story of "small time household inventor makes it big."  

Carmine D.

Hi D.I.B.

How many ways can i say the same thing.How much profit is enough,25,35,75,100,200,500,% markup,its also known that any company that advertises the way shall we call them the big 3,oreck,dyson,electroluxA.B.
Like to price gouge their dealer network, I have a clue what it costs them to manufacture each of their products,[trust me its lower than you think]

Not only do they offer coop advertising,but have a lot of corporate management to TAKE CARE OF,including keeping the bankers happy.The dealers have revolted already by offering the middlemen or distributors what they are willing to pay for a product,if you dont accept our CASH offer then you can eat the stuff,Ask wal-mart,ask sears,they will dictate to these companies what they want to pay and the pot better be sweet and stacked for the box stores.

Now is not a good time for any manufacturer to dictate how much they should sell a product for,who can sell it,how many they have to buy, has to be bought through their authorized distributors[i.e. middle men],

Weather you like it or not the time has come for the dealers to take back what is really their business,i dont know if you noticed it lately but the vacuum cleaner business is falling off the cliff,The only thing dyson has going for him is that its privately held as far as i know,With all the money James is worth dont you think its time to give some of it back to the businesses that put him there?.

MOLE

CarmineD wrote:
Hi Carmine,why would they want to do that ? It would blow their cover, The truth comes out sooner or later,by that time the culprits get away, or the way it works here is that they get the GOLDEN PARACHUTE for being incompetent.Doesn't make much sense any more.I'm stating to really wonder whats the schools of business are really teaching these people.

The government being run just like the syndicate........you know the one

Take care

MOLE

DysonInventsBig wrote:

DIB:

Since we are getting into the realm of fiction, I think you would enjoy reading, if you haven't already, The Bridge of San Luis Rey by Thornton Wilder.  It can be read as a novel about meaning -- how we assign and perceive meaning, how accidents and coincidences take on meaning in our daily lives. And in particular the conclusions Wilder wants us to draw about the human endeavor to find meaning in the world.  In particular note the character of Uncle Pio.  No relation to St. Padre Pio.

Wilder once declared "I am not an innovator but a rediscoverer of forgotten goods."  If you read The Bridge of San Luis Rey in the light of this remark it is very insightful.

Carmine D. 

mole wrote:

Hi MOLE:

To be vessals of sea going minnows!  The best business education I got was not inside the 4 walls of America's institutions of higher learning.  It was 40 plus years as a small business owner/operator.

Dyson should be ashamed of himself for bringing such a frivolous complaint against VAX.  VAX used the same testing organization and standards as dyson AND VAX sought/followed ASA's CAP advice for documenting and advertising the claim!  What was dyson thinking?

Dyson has 2 strikes against it with the ASA:  Electrolux and VAX.  Does the ASA have a "3 strikes and you're out" rule? 

Carmine D.

Hi Carmine,more than likely because they were sucessful at this little ploy at one time,against HOOVER, Kenny and the ball fiasco.IONA, etc.

Venson what do you make of all this,Were looking forward to your words of wisdom..........


MOLE

CarmineD wrote: Carmine,

Fiction?  Is God given insight fiction?  Can genius ideas come to the non-genius? - If so, how does it come (from God or from man)?

Concepts in book form.  Sorry to disappoint, I am no follower of the ideas and philosophies of men.        DIB

mole wrote:

Hiya MOLE,

As a consumer, I can't claim much wisdom in this except that it's a known fact that people will get up to all kinds of off-the-wall stuff for all kinds of reasons if they feel desparate about money. 

In this case, as the Bible and Thorton Wilder have been quoted or reffered to, why not toss in Machiavelli?  "The end justifies the means."  If you think you can't outsell 'em, look for a way to knock 'em out of  the game some other way?  Skullduggery of the most vicious sort.  In this case, I think the intention was to win but if it was they should have taken a closer look at their cards, folded and waited for the next deal.  I'd assume crying over every little thing soon wears thin with the powers that be.  There's only so much sympathy anyone with all that money can garner.  From there on only bribery gets you through.

If Dyson is all that much the big kid on the block, I don't get the nervousness and excitability over "inferior" product EXCEPT that the competition's prices, as mentioned prior,  are beginning to look awful nice to John or Jane Doe who need a vacuum cleaner, want a vacuum cleaner but can in no way justify a four-, five-, six-hundred dollar or more outlay of cash to get what to them is "just a vacuum cleaner."  And "just a vacuum cleaner" is going to be doing pretty good in the stores for a while.

Best,

Venson