Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Hi,

I was so enthused by Lucky1's report regarding the Miele S7 that I decided to run up the street and learn if our local vac shop had gotten any in so I might give one a try too.  The answer was no but we had an interesting conversation regarding his business as of late.  From this point on there should be no need for rantings regarding whose brand is best and what is and what ain't cyclonic.  I am simply passing on the sentiments of a gentleman who has been selling and repairing vacuums here at the same address in Long Island City for more than the last 15 years.  I've done business there before and feel the owner knows his onions.  I am more interested in learning what those who actually sell vacuums and repair will be adding or excluding regarding their inventory in the coming future.  Anyway . . .

We're not the richest but certainly not the poorest part of town here and, needless to say, I was a bit surprised at his answer and even more surprised when he said he'd be selling no Mieles now or ever.  His reasons for not were due to mapped pricing, the high cost of parts and also his feeling that there were vacuums just as good at better prices.  Per his teling of it, replacing a Miele telescopic wand prices at about $150.00. Laying a lot on the economy, he stated his customers are not necessarily willing to spring for vacuums that come at elevated prices. 

He also said that even a vacuum cleaner he really liked, the Riccar Radiance, has been dropped from his inventory because of less than enthusiastic shopper interest at his store by way of price.  Presently, he is banking on "disposable" vacuums to mainstay his business.  He does stock Riccar canisters and lesser uprights.  He also recommends the Sebo "automatic" uprights for durability if getting a good machine you plan to keep a while is on your mind.

I of course iinquired about Dyson, which he does not sell, and got a loud snort before the reply that,  "I have two in the shop now with burned out motors and they are less than two years old.  His spin on things is that the Dyson billions can sure support a lot of advertising and that that attributes more to the number sold than the quality of the machine.  He feels "yuppies" -- the young upwardly mobile -- probably think them all the rage due to their more advanced appearance and the belief that they'll cost nothing to maintain. Though the store owner did concede that Dyson is great on bare floors, he stuck to his guns as far as its less than stellar rug cleaning ability was concerned.

All things considered, I feel even more sure that door-to-door brands like Aerus, Rainbow, FQ, etc., are going to feel an even worse pinch.

Best,

Venson

Hi Venson,

Very interesting conversation, I agree with a lot of what he said as far as the current economic situation is concerned and how that is affecting/will affect consumer spending.  This is definitely *not* the time when people will be spending $500-700 for a vacuum cleaner, much less upwards of $1000 (like the Riccar Radiance and some high-end Mieles).  I think the lower-end Riccar uprights are of good quality and will definitely fill that niche for the time being.  Sebos are of good quality but rank up there with Miele price-wise, I have to wonder if anyone will be purchasing those as well.  I'm not going to comment about the Dyson remark other than to say that considering how their owners treat them, premature motor failure could very well be expected. 

Oh, and I always knew the term "yuppie" as slang for "Young Urban Professional," although really, either meaning fits quite well...

-MH

Hi MH,

I forgot to mention this particular person was highly skeptical regarding the new Miele upright.  HIs feeling was, despite the good press he'd heard, that Miele was known for canisters and that the company would be best served by sticking to onty their manufacture.  He made special mention as to how the MIele Art series appeared and then later abandoned just a few years down the line.

Best,

Venson

Hi Venson,your post makes me think that i'm talking at myself. This guys really TUNED in on the industry and can adjust his business to fit the economic situation,something that only seasoned veterans know how to do.

Does this dealer sell service and install central vacuums.

regards

MOLE

P.S. thanks for the info....................

Venson wrote:

Hi Venson:

I could quote your entire post for it's insightful views, rather than just the concluding statement.  But I wanted to make another point based on your conclusion.  Big box retailers will [if not already] feel the same decline in high price vacuum sales with brands like Electrolux, dyson, and the SEARS Intuition.  For example, SEARS regularly sells its top of the line Progressive upright [rated number ONE by Consumer Reports with an MSRP of $350] for $250 now.  And the SEARS Intuition with an MSRP of $600 comes with a $100 discount.  The latter is still too high for big box store vacuum buyers. 

The local BEST BUY store, open just over one year, doesn't carry any Electrolux vacuums in the store, save the Pronto [which may be the ErgoRapido now].  Never has.  BEST BUY stores is the sponsor for the Electrolux brand with Kelly Rippa as the spokesperson.  Back in April 2008, I asked the Housewares/Appliances manager of the store the reason.  She told me lack of interest and sales of Electrolux vacuums.  I haven't been back since and I'm due for a visit soon.

FWIW, the recent Youtube video that matched the Miele Calisto against the Sears Intuition, and recommended the Miele, was made in Vienna, Virginia.  The internet vendor is GOVACUUMS and is related with Vacuums Unlimited which has several store locations in the Washington DC Metropolitan area.  Some of their stores have been opened for over 30 years.  Vienna is located in Fairfax County, Virginia, a suburb of the Washington DC metro area.  Fairfax is either number one/two for the highest average yearly income in the country.  Rockville, Maryland, also part of the Washington DC metro area, is number one/two for highest average income depending on Fairfax's status.  [Side bar: While RICCAR/SIMPLICITY, Bosch, Miele and SEBO brands are visible in the Youtube video, to my knowledge and observations (please correct me if I'm wrong) there was no sign of a dyson]. 

I always enjoy talking with vacuum store owners/operators, having been one myself for a long time.  They usually have their pulse on the feel of the economy 6 months ahead of the business news and markets.  The vacuum business people are very aware of the business indicators, events, and cycles.  Those that have been in business for awhile can pin point facts and circumstances of economic and political events that impacted on their operations.

There are alot of bagless vacuum competitors now.  All price their models in the big box retail stores'  selling range: $100-$250.  These brands will fare okay when sold in concert with discounts.  The most expensive bagless brand never bothered to offer budget conscious consumers a model/models in this price range.  This is IMHO a shortcoming on its part especially in the current economic times worldwide.  [The founder's net worth according to Forbes went from $2 BILLION in 2006 to $1.6 BILLION in 2007].  Will he even make the Forbes cut in 2008?  More importantly, what will be the effect on the company's sales and business operations for 2008 and the out years?  Any insight to offer Matt mmc Airblade?

Thanks Venson.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:
Just to toss a ying in for your yang.  While the economy isn't as bad in Canada as the US we are still feeling the effects of all the financial turmoil.  Interesting then that Canadian Tire (big box) not only has an exclusive to the new Miele upright but will also be bringing in part of the canister line as well.  As I understand it from a Miele dealer, CT will be selling a canister with powerhead and hepa filter for $549-$569.  This same machine at the dealers store sells for $849 without a hepa.  I'd be curious to see how Miele handles online shopping across the boarder.  Perhaps Mieles in big boxes will start to show up in the US as well?  Also heard Sears Canada will be taking on the Miele line early next year too.  Times they are a changing.

Dusty

dusty wrote:

Hello Dusty:

Economy in the USA is very bad.  The worse I've seen in my lifetime and I caught the tail end of the Great Depression.  Miele-s are in a select few big box stores in the USA.  Rarely if ever are they advertised, let alone sold on sale.  They are primarily sold through independent vacuum cleaners stores.  Big box retailers are reporting that September sales are awful despite much larger discounts than normal.  Holiday season sales are predicted to be horrible.

I will take the ying and yang and synthesize into a yong.  MIELE made a conscious business decision to sell its vacuums in Canada in big box stores.  Why?  Think about it.  MIELE vacuum sales [not to mention appliances] worldwide are tanking.  The International Monetary Fund is meeting this week in Washington DC and its predictions for the World economies, not just the USA, are dismal.  Scary.  What does MIELE do in desperation to prop up its sales volumes.   Big box stores!  What does MIELE have to lose?  It's 4th down, 20 yards to go with no time outs and no time on the clock.  Pray for an open guy and throw it high in the sky!

Carmine D. 

mole wrote:

Hi MOLE:

I cut/pasted this excerpt that you posted on another thread.  I want to agree/respond to you and keep this thought on topic.

HOOVER made a conscious decision in the 60's to go the big box store venue at the expense of the independent vacuum store owners and operators.  Why?  Volume sales to be number one.  Was it ego? Profit?  Both? 

I think you're right about MIELE.  History repeating itself in the vacuum industry.  However, I think MIELE, unlike HOOVER, is looking to carve out the high end vacuum market with the number one spot.  It has dyson, Aerus, Electrolux, RICCAR, Kirby, and all the high end import vacuum brands in its sights.  Why?  Not ego.  Profit!

TTI is consolidating the disposable vacuum market with its buy ups and takeovers of HOOVER, DIRT DEVIL etc.  Who's next?  Will MIELE do the same with the high ends brands?  Time will tell.

Carmine D.

Hello Carmine, I believe that most vacuum manufactures and their distributors are looking for any way to survive this economic nightmare[ wheather its been manufactured or not] . Its been a false economy for many years [trickle down or voodoo economics call it anyhting you want,the human race has been played for SUCKERS.

Its survival of the fittest, dog eat dog,the weak players will get thrown to the wolves, I firmly believe that within 10 years [10 or15 companies will own everything in the world.

Isnt socialism great""

ENOUGH......................................

SINCERLY

THE-MOLE

It's already happened.. You forget, Wal-Mart owns all!

mole wrote:
I beg to differ as to that socialism comment. Sorry to say, what you are describing is the nightmare of unchecked "CAPITALISM". I've always said every "ism" in it's purest form is destined to destroy itself. Without a degree of protectionism, capitalism will eat up the competition and render itself into a monopoly.

Lucky1 wrote:
Agreed.

Lucky1 wrote:

Hello MOLE, DIB, Lucky1 et al:

Then the monopoly owned industry, like the banks, goes belly up and asks the Gov't for a bail-out, the Gov't buys them and you have socialism!

"The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt

 should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and

 controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest

 Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living

 on public assistance."     Cicero - 55 BC  Sapientia Romana

Carmine D.

That too!

Hi,

For anyone interested, here a link to a June 2008 article in Appliance Magazine.

http://www.appliancemagazine.com/editorial.php?article=1983&zone=1&first=1

Best,

Venson

Funny my high end vacuum sales are up 20 percent this year it is my lower end that suffers, we are in a affluent Cleveland suburb and the pinch has not yet affected us, hopefully this continues as Mieles flagship upright will be in soon.

Venson wrote:

Hi Venson:

Terrific article, thanks for posting.  I missed it in part because the stands don't carry the magazine.

Vacuums appear to be on the leading edge for small household appliances when it comes to going green.  TTI [Glenwillow, OH] with the AccuCharge and Energy Star Rating uses 70 percent less electricity on battery recharging.  The latter has other benefits as Mike Mullens, TTI Engineer, points out.  The battery life lasts longer and the run time over the length of the product life is not compromised.  I mentioned that I use the HOOVER Slider, a cordless stick vac, for quick pick ups.  When new, this product has a 25-30 minute run time.  Now 2 years old, the run time has diminished.  Why?  Due to battery charging over time reducing the life and effectiveness of the batteries.

AccuCharge, which gets the Energy Star Rating, is now available in the Dirt Devil hand helds and sticks.  The process reduces the electricity from the adaptor to a trickle once the unit is fully charged.  This reduces energy usage [electricty], reduces heat build -up [fire hazard in adaptors], extends battery life, and keeps run time consistent over the product life.  Why?  As batteries overcharge they produce excessive heat which degrades the battery materials and fluids.  This in turn reduces the battery life and the run time over time.  AccuCharge prevents overcharging and its other negative consequences.   

BISSELL uses a majority of recyclable products in its Little Green Machine product and carton/packaging.  It has plans by the end of 2008 to use 75 percent of the recyclable materials in the product.  Wonderful! Well done Mark BISSELL, CEO!

Noticed even the halo got mentioned but with the caveat that UV-C light can cause skin cancer if misused.  BTW, the BEST BUY in NLV after selling these vacuums at clearance/discount prices has no plans to re-stock and sell.

Thanks Venson. 

Carmine D.

Venson wrote:
Venson,

I have not read the entire article, but wanted to say a big thanks!  Keep em coming.

DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

Hello DIB:

One brand is conspicuously absent despite its lock on the manuverability market for vacuums.  Must have been a gross oversight.  Or it may be a message that identifying and targeting a hyped market, unless it is embraced by the buying public, is meaningless and made up.

Carmine D.