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M00seUK


Joined: Aug 18, 2007
Points: 295

Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Original Message   Jan 17, 2008 3:54 pm
Replies: 277 - 286 of 535Next page of topicsPreviousNextNext page of topicsAllView as Outline
CarmineD


Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #277   Apr 9, 2008 1:56 pm
M00seUK wrote:
...What's most surprising to me is that they're relaunching 'the ball' with a decent amount of publicity and it's like the first launch never happened.



Hello M00seUK:

I agree.  My sense is that Mr. Dyson wants the ball technology to be his legacy for vacuums, not necessarily cyclone root technolgy.    I think its a gamble.  Why?  The original ball DC15 was claimed to be the greater dyson by the dyson heralders.  It was not.  Now downsized and with some tradeoffs it's reinvented and relaunched.  Timing now is very bad economically.  Same was true for the GE upright with the ball wheel in the 60's.  GE had a nice design, was lightweight and easy to maneuver.  A decent performer for the day but vacuum buyers just were not interested.  Will it be different this time around?  Dyson has to find a way to entice new vacuum buyers to the new baby ball vacuums.  Ads help but are they enough to convince new vacuum buyers to purchase? 

Carmine D. 

This message was modified Apr 9, 2008 by CarmineD
M00seUK


Joined: Aug 18, 2007
Points: 295

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #278   Apr 9, 2008 2:47 pm
It’s a tough call for them. Like with any product development, you’re always finding out better ways to improve the end result. If you keep putting off going in to production, you risk ever increasing R&D costs with no immediate sign of return on investment. In Dyson’s case, they could see their patents for the Dual Cyclone expiring one-by-one and needed to pull something out of the bag to continue to justify the premium price they charge for their product.

The initial launch of ‘the ball’ validated the design, but the complexity of it appeared to undermine the margins that manufacturer and retailer could get from the end user.

Economically bad timing? Hrmm.. it depends how you see demand in the face of a possible recession. A fall off on higher end cars, yes. All a car really has to do is get you from A to B in relative comfort at a good MPG. A higher-end vacuum, offering a unique feature at a slight premium? In my mind, you either have next to no money and will spend £50 on a vac or you have a bigger budget and will consider a vac’s cost / features on merit.

This message was modified Apr 9, 2008 by M00seUK
DysonInventsBig


Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #279   Apr 9, 2008 3:21 pm
M00seUK wrote:
I have to admit, when first viewing this clip I did wonder this myself... hey, I'm a red-blooded guy with certain observational skills! But the inclusion is subtle and it's (I think) impossible to say if it was intentional.

As a side note, I understand that Dyson no longer uses an ad agency in the traditional role for TV ads. They prepare their creative briefs in-house and work with a director to bring the results to screen.

What's interesting about the more recent adverts is they make a point of underplaying the brand. i.e. the previous Airblade advert, of which the main objective doesn't appear to be to create awareness of Airblade, but simply to say "Hey, I'm James Dyson - you already know my company makes... here's something else we're doing...". "aren't we the greatest? - keep buying the vacs!"
 
This latest 'ball' advert says "This is something that has unknowingly caused you grief in the past". "This is why.." (shows four wheeled model). "This is a ball - look it moves nicely". Then there's a blink and you'll miss it shot of a vacuum with a ball going around the corner.

It's the classic persuasive sales role. It's not telling you that you should buy the vac. It's highlighting the problem and offering you a remedy and the path to a solution which will play on the mind of people... while they're pushing their 4-wheel uprights around their house.

What's most surprising to me is that they're relaunching 'the ball' with a decent amount of publicity and it's like the first launch never happened.

Moose, I believe the placement of the woman with painted on jeans was intentionally place there for men viewing the ad.  No harm, I believe.        DIB

This message was modified Apr 11, 2008 by DysonInventsBig



CarmineD


Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #280   Apr 9, 2008 4:15 pm
DIB:

You turned this thread from the 'ball' to the 'butt.'

That's not a dyson she's using. 

Great ad for ladies' jeans!

Carmine D.

This message was modified Apr 9, 2008 by CarmineD
DysonInventsBig


Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #281   Apr 9, 2008 4:55 pm
CarmineD wrote:
DIB:

You turned this thread from the 'ball' to the 'butt.'

That's not a dyson she's using. 

Great ad for ladies' jeans!

Carmine D.


Carmine.  I was hesitant for posting or commenting of this ad, butt thought it was interesting enought to post.  James has mentioned in the past (launch) with the DC15 that he was targeting men.  He said their market research showed men were (if I remember correctly) interested in "The Ball" technologies, the DC15.  And he said men were more likely to vacuum than before using The Ball (technology).  Cost and weight seem to have gotten in the way of the DC15’s selling success.  I own the DC15 and think it is great except for the weight and I too, felt it was to pricey. - So I bought a Best Buy floor demo which has worked flawlessly.        DIB

This message was modified Apr 9, 2008 by DysonInventsBig



DC18


Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user

Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #282   Apr 9, 2008 5:11 pm
DIB

Thanks for you thoughts and comments on the DC24 and DC25.  Not much to setup on the DC24 then!?  I have to say I think James Dyson and Dyson are pushing the DC24 and DC22 the small machines than their bigger brother version DC25 and DC23. 

I saw the TV ad in the UK 2 days ago, short and to the point.  I'm surprised the DC25 didn't feature along with the DC24!

One thing I did notice the handle weight on the DC18 is heavy comapred to the early DC04!  I thought the DC25 was very lite!

DC18

This message was modified Apr 9, 2008 by DC18
DC18


Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user

Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #283   Apr 9, 2008 5:20 pm
I personally don't think the 'new' ball vacuums have more publicity than the original DC15 Ball.  There was pre TV ad to give us a taste of what was to come before the DC15 launched.  There still is a separate web purely for the DC15 that goes into depth about the new product and it new technologies.  Then there was another TV showing the full product and a full launch from James Dyson.  With the DC24 and DC25 there has been the web info but very limited and the TV ad which has just come sout.  No offical launch in the uK as far as I'm aware (other conutries yes!).   All the publiciy is on the DC24 and not the DC25 or the other 2 new models DC22 and DC23.

I think Dyson is pushing the DC24 (and the DC22) more than the other 2 models DC25 and DC23 due tot hem being lighter and smaller but offer very good performance.  This is the route or one of them they will go down (has been mentioned in articles\interviews with James Dyson) and the ball technology being one of them!

DC18

This message was modified Apr 9, 2008 by DC18
DysonInventsBig


Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #284   Apr 9, 2008 5:41 pm
DC18 wrote:
I personally don't think the 'new' ball vacuums have more publicity than the original DC15 Ball.  There was pre TV ad to give us a taste of what was to come before the DC15 launched.  There still is a separate web purely for the DC15 that goes into depth about the new product and it new technologies.  Then there was another TV showing the full product and a full launch from James Dyson.  With the DC24 and DC25 there has been the web info but very limited and the TV ad which has just come sout.  No offical launch in the uK as far as I'm aware (other conutries yes!).   All the publiciy is on the DC24 and not the DC25 or the other 2 new models DC22 and DC23.

I think Dyson is pushing the DC24 (and the DC22)

DC18

DC18.  Yeah, I remember the dedicated web site for the DC15, I forgot about it until you mentioned it.  The Ball and Slim do indeed turn well.  I wonder if Dyson is going with "The Ball" for mid and lightweight vacuums only and using fewer cyclones, smaller bins with it's limited filtration.  I do not think Dyson is done launching vacuums.  The DC14 is on closeout at Best Buy and the DC07 is on closeout at Sears.

.

What do you guys think of the graphic Dyson is using on his web site and packaging when selling/showing the Ball series?  The graphic showing four wheels carriage vs. ball I thought it was vague, showed little detail and hard to understand.        DIB




DC18


Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user

Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #285   Apr 9, 2008 6:04 pm
DIB

I don't think the DC18 Slim turns as well as the DC15 and the new modles DC24 and DC25.  This I think is due to a small ball under the machine carriage on the DC18.

I think the DC07 and DC14 will disappear soon but a replacement is needed for the DC14 as that is quite a popular model in the UK!

I don't think Dyson is done with launching vacs as such!!   The marketing material is not as good for the new ball vacs, not as good as previous model launches.  Where is the 360 degree model spin, which they don't use anymore!   The info is very basic across all 4 new models and that don't push the core technoogy on the new canisters in the UK which is strange!

DC18

DysonInventsBig


Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454

Re: Dyson DC24 / DC25 Vacs: Sir James Brings his Ball back
Reply #286   Apr 9, 2008 6:09 pm
M00seUK wrote:
I have to admit, when first viewing this clip I did wonder this myself... hey, I'm a red-blooded guy with certain observational skills! Funny.  My observations landed me a hot wife (IMHO).   But the inclusion is subtle and it's (I think) impossible to say if it was intentional.

As a side note, I understand that Dyson no longer uses an ad agency in the traditional role for TV ads. They prepare their creative briefs in-house and work with a director to bring the results to screen.  I read this too.  Dyson and the ad firm parted ways only to have LG hired the agency.

What's interesting about the more recent adverts is they make a point of underplaying the brand. i.e. the previous Airblade advert, of which the main objective doesn't appear to be to create awareness of Airblade, but simply to say "Hey, I'm James Dyson - you already know my company makes... here's something else we're doing...". "aren't we the greatest? - keep buying the vacs!"   Moose, truthfully I do not understand all the theories of marketing, but I wondered this too/what you say.  I may add, James was just making us realize/reminding us he and his team are inventors and fix things/invent products missed by others.  James is using the phrase inventor in his ads, being an "inventor" got lots and lots of press and fame for Edision, it is nothing to shy away from.  
 
This latest 'ball' advert says "This is something that has unknowingly caused you grief in the past". "This is why.." (shows four wheeled model). "This is a ball - look it moves nicely". Then there's a blink and you'll miss it shot of a vacuum with a ball going around the corner.   I felt this ball model was shown well and long enough.  This James w/ ball wheel at desk, was followed up by his ball vacuum...  Here is what I am going to show you (James at desk w/ball) and now here I am (woman model) now showing you again and with the real thing (the product).

It's the classic persuasive sales role. It's not telling you that you should buy the vac. It's highlighting the problem and offering you a remedy and the path to a solution which will play on the mind of people... while they're pushing their 4-wheel uprights around their house.  Yes.

What's most surprising to me is that they're relaunching 'the ball' with a decent amount of publicity and it's like the first launch never happened.  The DC15 at the time was the only upright in the world that could manuver as well as it did.  I can change directions and whip my DC15 180 degrees very easily.  Heavy and expensive although.  Our house keeper struggles pushing it, you can see it in her face.  These new  "Ball" technologies will seperate his products from all others, in looks, function and sitting on retail shelving.  Think about it, Dyson launched 2 vacuums based on one technology and is selling these 2 vacuums using 1 t.v. commercial.  His well defined Dyson yellow is highlighting his newest technology (the ball).  I like the idea of out manuvering a 100 yr. old reality.  Even before Murry Spangler, folks were pushing/pulling sweepers in a more or less straight line.  Dyson and his team invented the fix.        DIB



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