Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Hello,

I am looking at purchasing a good vac for pet hair.  I am considering the above 2 or something else.  I prefer a bagless upright that has attachments.  I like the price of the Sanitaire.  I also would like something that is reliable.  Thanks for any help!

Hello Dusty:

If you compare dyson models to other big box store [bagged] brands, I would agree with you in part on the hassle factor for bagged vacuums.  But as we know from HARDSELL, there are a plethora of bagless brands in the big box stores too that compete with dyson and are much less expensive.  All the bagless advantages that you cite for dyson apply to these brands too.  No longer can dyson perpetuate the myth that its filters don't clog and require minimal maintenance.  This false claim allowed dyson to command the highest bagless vacuum prices in the big box stores.  No more!  Like MOLE says: The gig is over.

Compare the dyson vacuums with independent vacuum store brands [all of which are probably bagged].  Why?  Because the dyson high prices compete with these vacuum brands.  Bagged vacuum users who purchase the indy store brand vacuums buy their bags at those stores.  Probably once a year.  Not a big deal and effort.  If vacuum shoppers journey to the indy-s to purchase a quality vacuum, they will surely go back there without hesitation for the correct bags. 

Carmine D.

dusty wrote:

Dusty:

Is it fair to compare a $100 bagless [HOOVER Fold-away] with a $500 plus dyson for strengths and weaknesses?  No, not really.  Compare dyson with other $500 plus indy-vacuum store brands.  What do you decide to sell?

dusty wrote:

Dusty:

Here's where the argument for dyson appeal breaks down.  We know the myths and truths about dysons now.  Fair to middle of the road performer.  Filters clog.  Same filter maintenance required as the less expensive brands.  But the highest big box store vacuum prices.  Compare dyson bagless to other big box store bagless.  Why does dyson deserve the highest prices?  No longer can the dyson fans point to the filter free cares of dyson as the reason.  Can't argue the dyson 5 year warranty.  Other big box store brands have the same.  Now according to DIB, its the ball technology.  The ball that failed with the DC15.  I don't buy that argument.  Neither do others.  The dyson case for high prices falls apart there.  Be they at the big box stores and/or the indy-s. 

MOLE's right.  The dyson gig is up.  As ACERONE posted, most of the small dyson business dealers, like himself, are long ago out of business.  The big dyson dealers will follow.  The dyson honeymoon in the US is over.

Carmine D. 

CarmineD wrote:

You are always the first to compare all brands with Dyson.   I don't recall you taking (as example) an Oreck thread and start with the merits of Hoover, Miele or others.Thanks for the flattery. 

The less expensive brands do not filter so well so why worry with cleaning the filter.  My experience is that most dirt is past the filter in these.

As usual you left out the main reason that consumers choose Dyson, PERFORMANCE.

How many times have you told us that the Dyson gig is up and that Hoover would survive? Your batting average is not so good. 

CarmineD wrote:

All the knowledgeable know that those other bagless are only there for the price shoppers.  They can't compare with Dyson quality.

I refer back to your plasma.  Builder line of product to thrill the buyer when ii is little more than Junk.  Next you should upgrade that builder grade carpet.

HARDSELL:

The other bagged and bagless brands are dyson's competition.  Dyson is loosing market share to its competition here and abroad.  You and other dyson fans would have us believe that there is no competition for dyson out there.  Not the vacuum that never clogs and loses suction.  Right.  So why did you buy a bagged Royal Eminence for $299 when you can get a new dyson DC07 for the same if not less?  Competition is a wonderful thing for consumers.   Even former dyson owners like you.  Not so wonderful for the product makers.  HOOVER on my friend!

Carmine D.

I get it now DIB:  With dyson, the buyer spends $500 and gets an either/or choice.  Either supposed good filtration [if you believe the myth] with care free filter maintenance and/or ball technology and normal user filter maintenance.  What an innovative marketing ploy!  What if a dyson buyer wants both?  Out of luck?

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:
Yes, there are many bagless brands on the market.  The majority of which use a cartridge filter that sits in with all the dirt.  You can not tell me that they are just as easy to clean as the filter in a Dyson.  We have been running a Dyson in our store for almost 6 months and the secondary filter, while dusty is still very clean.  The Eureka Capture, which gets used far less has had to have the filter washed frequently.  Our bagless Panasonics and their cartridge filter are filthy and require constant cleaning.  The Bissell Healthy home may be a worthy contender but Bissell recommends changing the hepa filter every 6 months ($24.95) and washing the secondary filter at least once a month.  The secondary filter is also no where near the quality of the Dyson and I suspect after multiple washes you would have to replace that too.  Again, I'd have to give Dyson the edge.

I have no problem comparing the Dyson to high end vacuums.  The Sebo would be a good example...high end, geared belt, low maintenance.  Bags alone are roughly $20 and the bags with filter maintenance kit around $50. Over the course of 5 years the average customer would buy 3 packs of bags and 2 maintenance kits for a total of $160.  Add that to the cost of a X4 which is about $700 and you have a vacuum that will cost you $860 over 5 years. Geez, I could purchase 2 DC18's for that kind of money and never have to leave the house for bags.  Again, if it were me I'd buy the Sebo but for the consumer doing their own research it's not hard to see why Dyson have done so well.

As far as vacuum shoppers sticking to the indy's for bags and such I will disagree once again.  I'm frequently asked if there is somewhere "closer" to where the customer lives that they can buy bags or even worse...can I buy these at Wal-Mart. 

Dusty

dusty wrote:

Hello Dusty:

You said it all with the words I highlighted.  SEBO over dyson any day for a vacuum pro.  I agree.  Substitute any other indy-store vacuum brand for SEBO comparable in price to dysons.  What would you chose as better and sell to customers?

WRT vacuum customers doing their own shopping and deciding on dyson, they did in the past because of the overstated claims by sales persons that dysons didn't clog and the filters were virtually maintenance free.  Both are myths.  Now these claims are widely known in the industry as false.  Vacuum shoppers will shy away from dyson in the future in part due to the mediocre performance, in part the increased filter maintenance required for warranty, and most especially the high dyson prices.

With the cost of gas so high and going up, you have a point on shoppers and bags.  They may look elsewhere than the store of vacuum purchase.  They will probably go on-line and buy the bags to avoid gas and time. 

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:
Known in the industry perhaps, but not by the general consumer.  Even when we point out that bins need to be emptied and filters cleaned, the customer that comes in looking for a Dyson will still choose it over the majority of our bag models.  Again, just the thought of having to do a little less is all it takes for them to spend $500.  This is exactly why we decided to carry the line...it's easier to give the customer what they want rather than constantly selling away from it all the time.  It may not be my favorite machine but $200 profit in my pocket is better than letting Best Buy or Target have it.

Dusty

CarmineD wrote:

Judging from the positive Dyson reviews on this site alone it is evident that readers do not listen to your propaganda.  Only 1 review for Oreck and that is from a biased Carmine.

How far is the future.  I think it is now.  You have been telling us for three yeare that in the future Dyson will fail. The only one to falter is Carmine.