Vacuum Cleaners Discussions |
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DC18
Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #5 Aug 2, 2007 6:59 pm |
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DIB wrote: Hi DysoninventsBig Thanks for the news link! Gosh 8 New Vacuum Cleaners for the Globle Market I do hope they are something different with a new cyclone system that is totally new! Unlike Dyson to mention what they have planned! James Dyson usually likes to keep things close to his chest! DIB replys: : He should - keep his inventions quiet, he reminds me of Steve Jobs in this way. He has many enemies or competitors who would just love to steal or get advance warning of his upcoming products if they could. DC18 replys: suppose most people expect vacuums from Dyson which is no big secret, I would think the digital motor will feature heavly in some! I do feel they still have things to improve on! The DC18 Slim is one of the best uprights they have done for a while although it can not go fully flat on the floor like the DC03 does! Although the DC18 has the flexability to have different floor heads attached if they wanted to go down that route! DIB replies: Agreed. The Slim is his best overall upright (IMO). Do you live in England or UK? What's the DC03 like to use? Do you know why Dyson would produce a vacuum with dual and very large filters? DC18 replys: Think the DC18 is great! Love in the UK/England. Where you from?The DC03 is light and easy to use and push. Big long hose and easy to unblock and check for blockages. Good pickup. The only think was it's power. 700 watt motor is not that powerful, the tools where ok. You didn't get that feel of power like the DC07 (UK model) and brush effect like th e DC15 and DC18 with the DC03. It lack power something I told Dyson Customer Services. The bin for the size was ok, twin HEPA filter 1st ever, best filteration in a Dyson. Laid flat to go uder beds and furniture! The DC03 I think was produced to bring a lighter upright from the DC01, was the first Dyson to feature brush control, and already mentioned twin HEPA Filter, you can even hang it on the wall by the end cap on the top of the wand! Why did they re-launch the DC08/DC08 Telescope wrap as DC19 and DC20 Stowaway using Root 8 Cyclone dropping the Root 12! DIB replies: Funny. I have the Stowaway and have the DC08 cyclone w/bin. A little modifing and the 08 bin and cyclones fits onto the Stowaway. Why he switched is only a guess. - I think it was just a line refreshing/line extension. He is expected to always invent and come out with new and this was his choice. Perhaps there's only a minor difference between the Root12 vs. Root8 cyclones. I cannot tell. Certainly manufacturing a parts/cyclones, etc. to fit onto canister and uprights makes sense. The cyclone and shroud off the Stowaway is identical as the uprights. DC18 replys: One thing James Dyson said he would not re-package old technology - the DC19 and DC20 are repackaged DC08/DC08 TW's in a way. He could have put the trap door on the DC19, DC20 and DC21 like the DC12 and all the current uprights! The differance would be air flow maybe! 4 Cyclones less to push air through! Do you mean the DC14 pictures? They are off the UK DYson Website: http://www.dyson.co.uk/range/range_overview.asp?model=DC14&sinavtype=menu Quote DC18: More and more vacuums in the UK are copying the dual and root cyclone technology as well! DIB replies: Can you link some UK or non USA vac makers who are coming out with Dyson copies or alike? Thanks. DIB DC18 replys: Vax.co.uk is one in the UK, uk.LGE.com, I believe Samsung has one out in a cylinder version. I understand the Dual can be copied as the patent has ran out, but can not believe the root patent has ran out as yet! Dyson need to move his technology on to be differnet again! DC18 |
DC18
Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #6 Aug 2, 2007 6:59 pm |
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DIB wrote: Hi DysoninventsBig Thanks for the news link! Gosh 8 New Vacuum Cleaners for the Globle Market I do hope they are something different with a new cyclone system that is totally new! Unlike Dyson to mention what they have planned! James Dyson usually likes to keep things close to his chest! DIB replys: : He should - keep his inventions quiet, he reminds me of Steve Jobs in this way. He has many enemies or competitors who would just love to steal or get advance warning of his upcoming products if they could. DC18 replys: suppose most people expect vacuums from Dyson which is no big secret, I would think the digital motor will feature heavly in some! I do feel they still have things to improve on! The DC18 Slim is one of the best uprights they have done for a while although it can not go fully flat on the floor like the DC03 does! Although the DC18 has the flexability to have different floor heads attached if they wanted to go down that route! DIB replies: Agreed. The Slim is his best overall upright (IMO). Do you live in England or UK? What's the DC03 like to use? Do you know why Dyson would produce a vacuum with dual and very large filters? DC18 replys: Think the DC18 is great! Love in the UK/England. Where you from?The DC03 is light and easy to use and push. Big long hose and easy to unblock and check for blockages. Good pickup. The only think was it's power. 700 watt motor is not that powerful, the tools where ok. You didn't get that feel of power like the DC07 (UK model) and brush effect like th e DC15 and DC18 with the DC03. It lack power something I told Dyson Customer Services. The bin for the size was ok, twin HEPA filter 1st ever, best filteration in a Dyson. Laid flat to go uder beds and furniture! The DC03 I think was produced to bring a lighter upright from the DC01, was the first Dyson to feature brush control, and already mentioned twin HEPA Filter, you can even hang it on the wall by the end cap on the top of the wand! Why did they re-launch the DC08/DC08 Telescope wrap as DC19 and DC20 Stowaway using Root 8 Cyclone dropping the Root 12! DIB replies: Funny. I have the Stowaway and have the DC08 cyclone w/bin. A little modifing and the 08 bin and cyclones fits onto the Stowaway. Why he switched is only a guess. - I think it was just a line refreshing/line extension. He is expected to always invent and come out with new and this was his choice. Perhaps there's only a minor difference between the Root12 vs. Root8 cyclones. I cannot tell. Certainly manufacturing a parts/cyclones, etc. to fit onto canister and uprights makes sense. The cyclone and shroud off the Stowaway is identical as the uprights. DC18 replys: One thing James Dyson said he would not re-package old technology - the DC19 and DC20 are repackaged DC08/DC08 TW's in a way. He could have put the trap door on the DC19, DC20 and DC21 like the DC12 and all the current uprights! The differance would be air flow maybe! 4 Cyclones less to push air through! Do you mean the DC14 pictures? They are off the UK DYson Website: http://www.dyson.co.uk/range/range_overview.asp?model=DC14&sinavtype=menu Quote DC18: More and more vacuums in the UK are copying the dual and root cyclone technology as well! DIB replies: Can you link some UK or non USA vac makers who are coming out with Dyson copies or alike? Thanks. DIB DC18 replys: Vax.co.uk is one in the UK, uk.LGE.com, I believe Samsung has one out in a cylinder version. I understand the Dual can be copied as the patent has ran out, but can not believe the root patent has ran out as yet! Dyson need to move his technology on to be differnet again! DC18 P.S I have seen the Bissell Vacs that are a clone of Dyson. I'm a Fan of Bissell Pro Heat Carpet washers! What do you think of this vacuum - Sebo?: 
I've been told (bags/bagless aside) that these are better than Dyson!
This message was modified Aug 2, 2007 by DC18
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DC18
Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #7 Aug 2, 2007 7:43 pm |
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Copies of Dyson Technology:   
Swift Zero Turboforce Zero Performance Zero All by Vax (UK) LG (UK) have removed there Dyson versions only the Compressor is there! 
Samsung UK Version SC9120 Multi Chamber System with a difference! 
This message was modified Aug 2, 2007 by DC18
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DysonInventsBig
Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #8 Aug 3, 2007 12:46 pm |
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DIB wrote: Hi DysoninventsBig DC18 replys: suppose most people expect vacuums from Dyson which is no big secret, I would think the digital motor will feature heavly in some! 8/3/07 DIB replies: Dysons critics expect Dyson to reinvent constantly. A bit unfair. But his fans just want to see new and exceiting things. The digital motor will be his next big revolution. This will alow him to radically change the upright and canister. Imagine, your Slim with the DDM inside a small ball or ontop of the main wheel/roller versus having it in the handle as it is now. I weighed the handie weight of The Ball vs. The Slim and the weight is identical. No improvement at all even though the Slim looks lighter at the handle/body. Also Dyson can put (perhaps) a DDM (Dyson Digital Motor) in the nozzle vs. a standard motor. Why? A lighter weight and to manage speed or perhaps it can manage its own speed. He claims his motors are half the weight but very cheap to manufacutre. The computer chip he claims is the real cost for this motor and so is hoping this price comes down. He is working on shrinking the DDM electronics. DC18 replys: Think the DC18 is great! Love in the UK/England. Where you from?The DC03 is light and easy to use and push. Big long hose and easy to unblock and check for blockages. Good pickup. The only think was it's power. 700 watt motor is not that powerful, the tools where ok. You didn't get that feel of power like the DC07 (UK model) and brush effect like th e DC15 and DC18 with the DC03. It lack power something I told Dyson Customer Services. The bin for the size was ok, twin HEPA filter 1st ever, best filteration in a Dyson. Laid flat to go uder beds and furniture! The DC03 I think was produced to bring a lighter upright from the DC01, was the first Dyson to feature brush control, and already mentioned twin HEPA Filter, you can even hang it on the wall by the end cap on the top of the wand 8/3/07 DIB replies: I live in Los Angeles. Were you able to see any of the Tour de France in person? Is the DC03 pre-motor filter small? - Compared to other Dysons, what size is the filtert approximately? Thanks for your DC03 knowledge. I have been wondering why this vac was in Dysons product lineup. DC18 replys: One thing James Dyson said he would not re-package old technology - the DC19 and DC20 are repackaged DC08/DC08 TW's in a way. He could have put the trap door on the DC19, DC20 and DC21 like the DC12 and all the current uprights! The differance would be air flow maybe! 4 Cyclones less to push air through! 8/3/07 DIB replies: Dysons has indeed re-packaged his canisters somewhat. But in the wand, nozzles and turnable nozzle he has made changes indeed. Reinventing is not easy and so I believe the new color and changing the 12 cyclones for the 8 cyclones is ok. Just as long as he is reinventing/inventing in his "Invention Factory" (Thomas Edision's workshop was called this). Dyson not only vacuum manufacture but mostly an inventor and wants to invent above all else. Interview after interview he much enjoys talking of inventing versus talking business and enjoys inspiring and encouraging and helping kids become engineers and inventors. And his past (prior to vacuums) demonstrates this too. Just to let you know, I am not vac dealer or collector but have invented some widgets in the past and have had many of the same experiences as Dyson - NIH attitude (Not. Invented. Here. and so your widgets are not wanted, even though they prove to be an improvement) Many a time I've met with manufactures and they love my widget but tell me we are not going to license. And so Dyson's background in many ways I can relate to. I have also had a widget copied by a manufacture I presented to and sold in the largest US retailers. A huge lesson learned! And so I study James Dyson and believe he is a modern day Thomas Edison. Dyson is also a super humble man. Dean Kamen is also a prolific inventor. And many inventors in my family (long ago). Very cool to see my families inventions around the world. No money though, inventions were sold outright or unpatentable. None the less it is super cool to see how my family’s inventions or ideas have made it big. This is why I have no tollerance for those who put down inventors or those who applaud those manufactures who try to steal inventor’s property. DC18 replys: Vax.co.uk is one in the UK, uk.LGE.com, I believe Samsung has one out in a cylinder version. I understand the Dual can be copied as the patent has ran out, but can not believe the root patent has ran out as yet! Dyson need to move his technology on to be differnet again! DC18 P.S I have seen the Bissell Vacs that are a clone of Dyson. I'm a Fan of Bissell Pro Heat Carpet washers! 8/3/07 DIB replies: Dysons dual-cyclone patent here in the US was issued in 1986. Expired (I believe) in 2006. In 2006 we now see Dysons dual copied by his competition. What do you think of this vacuum - Sebo?: 8/3/07 DIB replies: Truthfully I have never heard of the Sebo until a few months ago. I can only comment on the filtration. I enjoy looking at patentable technology and from whomever. If someone, anyone can think out of the box, then thats good. I believe the Sebo is a bag vacuum..
8/3/07 DIB replies: Check out how Dyson gave Sebo "an education" (a US phrase) on bag filtration vs. Dyson’s dual filtration a ASA's web site. Here. This is why Dyson's other competitors have not challenged his filtration versus their bag.
Take care,DIB P.S. Thanks very much for the photos and links to the cyclone and/or Dyson clone makers. I've got to go for now and will look for your future posts.
This message was modified Aug 6, 2007 by DysonInventsBig
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DC18
Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #9 Aug 7, 2007 4:28 pm |
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Hi DIBThanks for the replies! Suppose it is unfair but his fans and followers (like me!) do expect new and exciting products from his design lab! But then he has always said that is what Dyson is about making things work better and being different too! I know the DDM is going to be big, it's already in the DC12 Cylinder in Japan (which is a big success) and adapted for the Dyson Airblade so it has it uses in many things! I believe they are already working on the 3th/4th generation of this motor looking at like you said shrinking the DDM electronics! I did wonder if the 1st vacuum in the UK with DDM would be the DC18 Slim but it was not! I'm surprised the handle weight of the DC15 The Ball is the same as the DC18 Slim. One of the many reason I like the slim is the fact the hose/wand is the same diameter as the DC07/DC14 and prevoius model unlike the DC15 yet both have the same motor (1200 watt!). Also that it is lighter, I think that is the way vacuums need to go! The hose is shorter on the DC15 too! Maybe the DDM will feature in these new vacuums!? I didn't see any of the Tour De France! The DC03 Pre and Post Motor filters are the same size just different inside both being HEPA. I wouldn't say they were small, compared to other Dyson Filters. In fact I would say the total surface area is probably bigger! Probably about 2 and half inches in diameter and about 5 inches in height, each. Not sure of the exact size of both will try and find out! When the DC03 was launched it had the Big filter surface of any Dyson and I think at the time it was launched any other vac on the UK market (probably still does to an extent today!). The Post Motor filter was also designed to disfuss the air leaving the machine. It amazes me it is still available on Dyson's UK line up and still in some UK shops after all this time! It is light to use, the only Dyson upright to lie flat on the floor and go under low furniture and can be hung on the wall for compact storage! I believe it was a very popular Dyson model which is probably why it is still available. I thought once the slim was launched the DC03 would go but not yet, it still has advantages over the DC18 Slim! Thanks for the info on inventions. I'm no vac dealer myself. I've always had an interest in vacuums and especially since James Dyson came about. His investions are an inspuration to many people! So you have invented some widgets then? And your family too, cool! It must be nice to see though inventions at large! I've always had an interest in design/inventions, and have followed James Dyson since the first DC01 came out and continue to! He is just different to the normal that is one of the many things I like about him and his inventions! I know his Dual Cyclone patent has ran out but I thought the Root Cyclone patent had a few years left!? But so many are copying that now and you don't see Dyson acting on it! Well you don't hear about it! Probably he has a new cyclone system in the wings to replace both Dual, Root and US Level 3 Root! I was surprised he didn't use the new Level 3 Root Cyclone in a new version of the DC14 for the UK!? I've only got to know about Sebo through a family members who say they are very good! I know they have a bag but that aside for a minute they do use technology and incorporate it into their models. Apart from Dyson most if not all UK vacuums are cheap plastic looking things with no real thought gone intot them. Sebo looks like they have thought about the machine like Dyson does! I've not seen in the UK any other vac that uses computer controlled height adjustment in an Upright that senses the floor type and adjusts the cleaning head for you to suit giving optimium cleaing, or shuts off the machine if a blockage appears if the users carries on using it to protect the motor/belt! Interesting reading on Sebo V Dyson, thanks for th link. Dyson needs to come out with a commercial range, I thought he would have replaced the ConstantMax (DC04) in the UK with a DC07/DC14 version by now! I do hope these new vacuums of Dyson are different and bring new technologies to the floor care market. I do beleive once his DDM is introduced throught out the whole Dyson Vacuum Range Globally he will be onto another winner. One thing they must be greener to use than current motors!? Take care DC18 P.S. Hope you enjoyed the other photos/links to Dyson Copies!?
This message was modified Aug 8, 2007 by DC18
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DC18
Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #11 Aug 16, 2007 4:11 pm |
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Hello DIB Your more than welcome. Many thnaks for the links to the James Dyson Lectures. I enjoyed watching and listening to them! DDM will be hugh for Dyson once it goes 'large' in more Dyson products. They adapted I believe for the Airblade! From the lectures they are on version 2 and 3 of it! I wonder if one of the 8 new vacuums is robotic and if all 8 will feature the DDM!? About a month back a read some press articles that some launches will take place later this year and early next year! Not sure what, well must be some vacuum cleaners if they re planning 8 models globally!! The DC12 was rumoured to be coming here in the UK but has yet to make it! It's a ideal updated version of the DC05 light and small cylinder (canister) cleaner which would be good in the UK. It seems light, samll storage yet powerful vacuums seems to be the latest craze!! Thanks again for the links very interesting. Thanks DC18 |
M00seUK
Joined: Aug 18, 2007
Points: 295
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #12 Aug 18, 2007 2:26 pm |
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If correct, 8 upcoming new vacuum cleaner launches by Dyson is excessive, even by their standards. Here’s some of my predictions… 1) DC12 / (Baby?)
Dyson’s tiny canister has done well in the Japan - even at a high price, as the Japanese demand for small, hi-tech, UK-designed goods has proven consistent. It’s very likely it’ll be launched in the western markets soon, especially if they’ve evolved the Dyson Digital Motor to bring the component cost down. DC12 was even shown (then pulled) on UK electrical websites at the start of the year. I personally don’t have a Dyson cleaner at the moment, I’m waiting for this one – it would suit my (apartment) needs to a tee! 2) DC17 (Level 3 Root Cyclone)
Currently only sold in the US market, presumably as a desire to achieve maximum scores with the independent consumer tests. It’s quite likely it’ll be available in other markets at some point soon, if the new separation technology has been well proven so far. 3) Dyson ‘Robot’ cleaner
I’d like to think that with 8 machines rumoured to launch, this would be at least one of them. The patent filings for the mains cable tracking method sounds plausible. It they did go with this, they would likely also add a battery-powered version too, for folks that have money to burn on Lition-ion cells. 4) Dyson ‘KnuckleDuster’
KnuckleDuster is a new trademark that Dyson have applied for earlier this year:- http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tm/t-journal/t-tmj/journals/6680/domestic/2447617.html My guess would be that it’s either a cleaning tool accessory or more likely a follow up to the DC16 handheld cleaner. Dyson have likely recognised the importance of having a new, lower priced item each year for the x-mas gift buying session. 5) Dyson ‘SonicHead’
A few patents filed for this technology which uses ultra-sonic waves instead of a brush bar to dislodge the carpet pile. 6) Commercial Dyson (ConstantMAX)
The ConstantMax commercial cleaner has been discontinued for a while now. The commercial cleaning sector is a huge market currently exploited by their competitors. You can’t help but think that they’d want to stir this up at some point in the future.
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DC18
Dyson, Sebo and Bissell user
Joined: Jul 25, 2007
Points: 294
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #13 Aug 20, 2007 3:32 pm |
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Hi M00seUK Good predictions! 8 new vacuums sounds excessive but then again Dyson is a growing company globally. I take it the 8 are acroos different markets! Plus other projects in the pipeline like the return at some point of the washing machine! They have launch 5 or 6 not long ago...DC16, 17, 18, 19, 20, and DC21, although 8 in one go is excessive! I'm hoping the DDM will feature in a few of them, and hopfully like you say the DC12 will comer over here, well a newer version of it! The commercial market is an area I can't understand why Dyson has not launched a replacement for the DC04 ConstantMax, but then again the DDM could feature in a future Commercial product after the newer versions are complete using smaller electronics! The ‘KnuckleDuster’ sounds interesting! Will the Level 3 Root Cyclone feature in any of these new models or is there a new Dyson cyclonic system in the pipeline due to on going projects into cyclonic technology! With vacuums becoming smaller and lighter (which seems to be the craze in some markets!) Dyson needs to look at making his uprights more flexible and adaptable with the DC18 Slim going towards thoughs area's. DC18 |
M00seUK
Joined: Aug 18, 2007
Points: 295
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Re: No sign of any New Dyson Vacuum yet!
Reply #14 Aug 20, 2007 3:54 pm |
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In one sense, the digital motor could be good for a commercial cleaner, as it would potentially give the machine a longer life. However, in a lot of commercial environments, strong suctions power isn’t a major factor. Initial purchase cost is. Say you’re a facility manager with a £500 cleaning equipment budget. Do you buy 4 cleaners at £100 each (and £100 on replacement bags) or 2 high price cleaners at £200 each? With the first choice you can afford to have a few machines spare. There’s also the problem of theft, if you’re using a recognisable high ticket consumer item within a workplace.
The Dyson motor, by all accounts, produces more noise than a standard motor. As a result, the DC12 has two power settings. But using the DDM might reduce some of the criticism of the Dyson uprights, in that they’re heavier than most.
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