Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

December is here and I'm anxiously waiting for some good snow to arrive.  I've been bit by the 2 cycle bug recently.  I have the Toro 421QE, which is the 4 cycle version of the 221Q.  I thought it may be redundant to pick up a used 221Q so I've been looking into getting a Toro Powerlite.  Plus, I can hang the Powerlite up on a wall.  the 221Q is too big and heavy to do so.

Anyways, anybody got a recommendation for a compact SS two-cycle?  If not, please provide a 7 step sure fire way to cure the 2 cycle habit.  :)

Sounds like a broken or jammed spring.  First thing I'd try is spraying the spring with WD-40 or similar fluid to see if that frees up the spring.   If the spring is broken, you'll have to pull the assembly off to inspect it.  Often, the spring breaks at the bend/notch that secures it to the center of the recoil.  I've had pretty good success just heating the spring end until it's red hot and putting a new bend in it.  If it also needs to be notched, a small grinding bit and a Dremmel tool will work well.

Edit:

This might be of some use to you:    http://redhouseon7th.com/redhouse/howto/2008ToroPullCord/index.html

     It probably has a HSK600.   It would be good to review the machine before you do the pull start as it's a hassle to fix.  Plan any fixes or mods you want to do while you're in there.  You won't want to go back in again.   

     Tough machine to work on.  For a cowling removal it's easier to take the engine out than remove it in place. 
 
     BUT...once they go they stay going.  They're a great machine.  It will toss good condition snow 25 feet and average 15-20 - - not guessing I measured it.  You can tweak the governor spring post for 4500-5000 and see what you think.   It takes a bit to get used to it but as Borat says it sounds like a fast idle.   That is a very appropriate description.  I started my machine the other day and that is exactly what I thought.  That the thing was just getting warmed up and should have a throttle to get to speed.

I found a reference to it having a 98cc Tecumseh 2-stroke, so the HSK600 sounds like a very good guess (those are the specs of mine). Like borat said, spraying a bit of something on the recoil spring would be worth a shot. Perhaps silicone, if you wanted to reduce the risk of attracting dirt. Make sure you don't accidentally lube the belt If the spring is just weak, or slipped somehow, you can turn the cord hub some more, to increase the preload on the spring, then wind the cord around it.

This has a much higher "specific power" than my Ariens. Both have the same 3hp engine, but yours is 16", and Ariens swung for the fences and made mine 22". Yours ought to do a lot better with full passes in deep/heavy stuff.

If you do a compression check on it, I'd be curious what you get. I got 90 psi on my engine. But it apparently has a compression release, which would lower the result somewhat.

You put $100 in parts into it already today? Wow, you're quick. Ramping up the RPMs would be worth looking into, power/weight would get even better. Nice find!

@aa335, wish you the best luck and a lot of fun making it new again.  I am sure you will make it very good just like your HS621.  I am just waiting for the dealer go $400 even on the 221Q.  I just have to wait a month then I think I have a good shot at the price.

Thanks all for the tips.  I found this Powerlite is a 2007 model,  with a Tecumseh HSK635 - 1723C engine.  Looks like the scraper bar and rubber paddles will have to be replaced.  It can probably go another winter season but since I'm working on it, might as well replace them.  I'll get a new belt and spark plug as well.  There are nuts and screws here and there that are corroded, I'll break those lose and replace them.  Not fond of Toro's choice of fasteners hardware, seems to rust too easily.  I haven't bought any parts yet, but should be able to get it back in top shape for less than $60 estimated, maybe a little more if I'm picky.

No plans to modify it yet, although bumping the RPM is fairly easy to do.  I was surprised to find out that the engine is part of the structural frame.  The lower handle is the frame!    Not sure how well the engine and the frame will handle the extra power.    I was so used to seeing how well built the Honda HS621 is and this Powerlite was an eye opener. 

It was late tonight so I didn't feel like doing any work on the carburetor.  I was just looking around and see which parts needs to be replaced and which needs some paint touch up.  The Powerlite is very simple in design, extremely compact and so lighweight.  I was able to easily lift it and fiit it in the back seat of my car.  This is a perfect machine to leave on your wooden deck, especially if you have a few stairs. 

MN_Runner wrote:
Yes, this machine is about 4 years old and has one owner with the typical homeowner use, so it's not too beat up.  Everything looks original so the wear items like rubber paddles and scraper bars are at their service limit and need to be replaced.  It's a fairly inexpensive machine for me to play with. 

Anyways, good luck on getting the 221Q with the price you're waiting for.  Don't wait too long, there aren't many new ones sitting around.  I'm sure you rather get something brand new to you for a few bucks more. 

RedOctobyr wrote:

The Powerlite has good power to its size.  Also the rotating mass of the auger assembly is very low, so it's very efficient.

I did looked into getting the Ariens SS a few years ago, I think the Simplicity was very similar, with the fancy molded auger.  I don't think Ariens or Simplicity makes these snowblowers, they are probably made by someone else because mechanically, they were very similar.  The machines were very well built, nice solid handles.  The molded auger kinda of turned me off due to cost of replacement and heavy mass that didn't have powerful engine to drive it. 

I haven't bought any parts yet, just estimating that will need to spend about $60.  I have no tools to do compression check on the engine so I'll just get it running and that will be it.  The snowblower is only 4 years old with light duty homeowner use so I'm fairly sure it's still has good compression.

Does that machine have an auger engagement lever or does it turn as soon as the engine is fired up?

Five years old is pretty fresh provided it wasn't straight gassed.  As long as it was properly lubed, the engine should be fine.  The old 1997 Craftsman I bought used had around 120 psi.  That's pretty much factory spec.  Pretty good for a fifteen year old machine. 

Don't be afraid to mix a bit more oil than what the manual specifies.   Especially if you crank it up a bit.   I run most of my premix around 35:1 to 40:1.  Never had a problem yet.  Not even a fouled plug.

Did you inspect/fix the recoil yet?  I'm interested to know what the cause of the problem is/was.  

borat wrote:
The Powerlite doesn't have auger engagement bail.  There's a belt tensioner that is always spring loaded so the auger spins when I pull the starter cord.  I can't tell the health the engine by pull start, there's an automatic decompression to make it easy to turn over. 
I don't have tools to measure compression.  Is there any tell tale signs like excessive smoke?  At least the engine is not locked up from being straight gassed.  I think the engine should be very fresh.  Like I said before, one owner, light residential duty, single car wide driveway, not very big area to clear.

I haven't open up the recoil assembly to determine what's wrong.   I am planning to buy a new cord and put it in while I have it apart.  The weather has been fairly warm so I'm enjoying the weather outdoors with the kids so I've been a little lazy in any mechanical work at night.  :)

If I experiment running higher RPMS, I will definitely use more oil than recommended.  From my days of RC nitro metthane car engines, I tend to run the engine a little rich just to get a little safety margin.  I don't have much time these days for those tempermental high output RC engines.  I spend more time cleaning them than running them.  :)

aa335 wrote:
Heh, well put. "the fancy molded auger" is a pretty good way to describe it. It is certainly expensive to replace, which is unfortunate. The machine was sold under at least 1 other brand name, there were green ones sold as Lesco, which were covered in the SS322 recall. They might have been sold under another brand as well, of course, which simply wasn't covered by this recall.

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml00/00059.html

I don't think a worn 2-stroke should smoke any more. A worn 4-stroke smokes because the oil in the crankcase is getting past the worn out piston rings, making the engine smoke. In a 2-stroke, the only oil is already in the gas, so I don't think that a worn engine would smoke differently. It would still be down on power, of course. The simple & fairly easy way I know to check a 2-stroke's condition is to pull off the muffler, and look at the side of the piston and the cylinder. You should not see vertical scratches/gouges, it should still show a smooth crosshatched pattern.

borat, good point about the oil ratio. I just mixed up a fresh gallon with Stihl Ultra at the suggested 50:1. I should have used a bit less gas and gone for, say, 40:1, especially for higher RPM's. Unfortunately, I have the little 1-gallon-mix bottles, so I can't easily add more after the fact. I do run my old Stihl 032AV chainsaw a little rich, to be safe. The magic of adjustable carbs! My saw is 51cc, and revs to 13,000 RPM, but of course the piston and things still weigh quite a bit less than those in my 98cc snowblower engine, so that helps keep the loads under control. Plus, of course, it was designed for 13,000, and I'm not ramping it up to 18,000 :)

aa335, sorry to go on a slight tangent, but you caught my eye with the RC nitro engines comment. About 10 years ago I bought an RC nitro-powered Team Associated RC10GT stadium truck. Had a .12 in^3 OS engine, I eventually upgraded it to a .12 Mugen engine, which added a bunch more power. That thing was a ton of fun. I haven't run it in about 5 years, unfortunately. Those engines do make a mess of the car :) About a year ago I got into RC electric helicopters, they're a blast. Started with a coaxial toy, then got Blade mSR fixed-pitch, then a Blade mCP X collective pitch. The mCP X will do flips, loops, flies upside down, etc. And it's only about 10" long or so, not counting the main rotors. I'm working on hovering inverted in different orientations. I upgraded the stock brushed motor to a brushless setup, it raised the main rotors RPM from about 3800 to almost 6000. It's kind of a little beast now, and has the power to try a lot more aggressive stuff. Sorry, my apologies for going OT.