Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I was about to make a phone call to the dealership in Wisconsin this morning to order a 221Q.  Before doing so, I decided to take a run to Home Depot to see what they had in stock.  I had thoroughly gone through their web site and it was less than helpful.  Terrible in fact.  Probably the worst big box store internet site I've tried.  Nonetheless, I took the trip into town to see what they had.  I was thoroughly surprised and pleased to see two new 221QE machines sitting on the floor.  Price was marked down 25% from $899.00 to $599.00.  Don't know who's doing their math but that works out to 33.3% in my books.  Regardless, I scooped one up right then and there.  I've got it down in the basement for a good once over before I put it to work.   We're supposed to get five or six inches of snow tonight and tomorrow so, I'll be submitting my review. 

yeah, I've got a serious two stroke habit.   I mean, really, what's not to like about them? 

My first setting of the governor was a bit too high.   No load speed was around 4200 but after working the machine for fifteen minutes or so, the engine speed went up to 4400 - 4500 rpm.  Way to fast for comfort.  It was pulling me down my 10% grade driveway at a dangerous clip.  I made another adjustment and set it back to 4100.   That's the best setting for control and power.   I'm thoroughly impressed with it.  However, my modified Craftsman doesn't give up much to it when it comes to moving snow.  Plus it's quite a bit lighter and easier to manage than the Toro because it doesn't have the same amount of paddle contact with the ground and doesn't pull anywhere nearly as well as the Toro.  Not really a bad thing actually.  It's a lot more neutral on flat ground.  When it comes to going up the grade on the driveway, the Toro is the machine you want.  I have to coax the Craftsman up the hill whereas, the Toro pulls itself up effortlessly, throwing snow a good distance while doing so.

The snow conditions were hardly a test for either machine.  Light fluffy stuff at first,  but once it had been moved around a bit, it had more substance to it and would toss much better.  

Overall, the Toro is an excellently designed machine.  Quick Shoot and deflector adjuster are real slick.  I'm surprised with the power of the engine.  Very strong for 141ccs running at only 4100 rpm.  The Tecumseh doesn't have anywhere near the same power at those rpms.  That may not be a fair comparison though, considering the Tecumseh is almost 14 years old.   Spin the old Tec up and the power is there in spades and it's amazingly smooth at higher rpms especially under load.   To be honest, the Craftsman is actually more fun to use because of it's weight and variable throttle.  Working the throttle gives more of a sense of participation rather than just ho-hum, follow and drag.   However, when it comes to getting the job done fast and efficiently, the Toro will be first out of the barn.

I tried to insert the following as hyper-links but the software will not allow me to.  You'll have to copy and paste to see them.   The first one is of the 1997 Craftsman 5/21, second is the 2011 Toro 221QE.  Both from this morning.

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5SUqWz0j8w  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCDyLJeXX4k


Trouts:  You asked what happened to the CCR 2000?   The woman selling was holding fast to her ridiculous price of $475.00.  There's no way that I'd spring for that kind of money when HD was selling brand a new 221QE for $599.00.

By the way, I called the the local Toro/Ariens gouger to see what their price was for the same machine and was astounded when they said I could "have" one for $999.00 before taxes.  After taxes, that would have been $1128.87!!!  Can you believe that?   There has to be a lot of stupid people in this town to keep that guy in business. 

borat wrote:

God must love stupid people...why else would he have made so many of them.

Great review.  Your Toro was throwing the snow impressively off to the right.  My former single stage Ariens couldn't touch that performance.  BTW, I just missed getting a Honda HS35 that was for sale locally for $150.  Called two minutes too late. 

Paul7 wrote:
Thanks for posting the pic of the fuel valve Marc.   Out of the way, nice and tidy.  It's good to see these machines coming with in-line fuel filters.   That will save a lot of people headaches for people.  Even the old Craftsman has a fuel filter on it.   

Paul7:

I saw a local add for a Honda HS35 selling for $250.00.  I thought about it.  Did some research and discovered it had an L-head engine which didn't appeal to me despite the fact that it's probably a great motor.  From what I read, the HS35 is a nice little piece of technology but wasn't a stellar performer.  Apparently not in the same league as the two cycle Toros and I do have a penchant for two stroke engines. 

Yeah, now that I have the Toro dialed in at 4100 rpm, it's much more manageable and doesn't give  away any noticeable power.  It's certainly a serious single stage machine and will likely be seeing much more work than my two stage Simplicity.  It's just that much easier to use and will handle 90% of the snow we get.      

Great  videos. I like your Craftsman. I have a Sears model from 2006 that was made by Murray. If it worked half as well as your Craftsman I would still be using it. I have a 221QE also. After watching your video it sounds like your machine is revving much higher than mine.  As I have some mechanical ability but almost no experience with OPE engines I was wondering if you could explain or ideally make a video of the process of changing the governor setting on these machines. It would be much appreciated, Thanks and good luck with the Toro.

A how-adjust video would be good but to duplicate Borat, you will need to have a tachometer so you can dial the rpm.

Amazon has one with a replaceable battery for under $20. Here's the link:

http://www.amazon.com/meter-tacho-hourmeter-stroke-HOURMETER-RL-HM011/dp/B0049IFX56

Will this do? Thanks!

ralphfr:

On the lower left side of the bottom shroud there's a cover that the choke handle pokes through.   Remove the screw and take the cover off.  You will see a spring that is horizontally mounted from a connection on the carburetor to a vertical tab.  Bending the tab ever so slightly to the left will increase engine speed.  It doesn't take much of an adjustment.  1/16th of an inch or less will give you a substantial gain in rpm.  Recommended rpms for this machine is 4000 +/- 100 rpm.  I have mine at 4100 rpm and it seems perfect for me.  Remember that increasing engine speed will increase travel speed as well as throwing distance.   I can live with all the throwing distance but can't keep up with the forward movement (particularly down hill)  with anything over 4200 rpm so, you'd be better off to keep the revs at a speed that will allow you to manage the machine.  You  should get yourself a mini tach to confirm your engine speed.  

BTW I found a post by SUPERBUCK(#23) that makes it sound pretty straightforward. Here's the link:

http://www.abbysguide.com/ope/discussions/46182-0-1.html 

Just saw you post BORAT. Great explanation. I will order a tach and check the current rpm. Thanks a lot!


Also in case anyone needs a picture I believe pic#18 on this page is what we're talking about. Thanks again.

http://outdoorpowerinfo.com/repairs/briggs_lawn-boy_plastic_carb.asp

borat wrote:
I have the 421QE and it does pull me down the hill too fast for comfort at times when there's ice on the pavement.  I have thought about increasing the RPM but would like a throttle control, for those times I don't need the extra power.  Most of the time, I don't really need more power, as 20-25 feet throwing distance is all to get the snow off the driveway.

borat wrote:
Does Toro allow dealers to sell over MSRP?  Sounds like the dealer doesn't have any competition and the only dealer in town so does whatever he wants.

That dealer in your area is definitely not the norm.  In my area, all Toro dealers, including Home Depot, all have fairly same price within $30 of each other.   None so far has anything over Toro's MSRP.