Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I am looking at replacing a 25 year old snow blower. I live in Iowa and have a driveway that measures roughly 70X30. I do get some nice drifting, last year over the bed of my old truck, and some nice piles at the end of the drive. I am looking at the Toro Power Max 2-Stage 26 in. Snow Blower and the Ariens Deluxe 2-Stage 28 in. Snow Blower. They are the same price so I am not really sure which one to buy. Any help would be appreciated.

 

if both machines have the same size motor l would go with Toro.

estroner wrote:

I have the Toro 1028OXE and Love it. You can easily buy a smaller unit like the 826. I have a 220 foot driveway and my EOD is at least 30 feet wide. Plus a 40'x40' section off of that. The 826 Toro will easily handle what you have. Plus you get the joystick which is a breeze to use and the dual trigger steering. Don't worry about the Toro's plastic chute it works well and snow doesn't stick to it. Toro's auger system really works and you can easily mow right into drifts. Oh and to do my entire driveway with 8-10 inches of snow takes 1-1.5 hours max.

The toro is 208cc and the ariens is 249cc. I should have mentioned that in my original post.

Not sure if you can try them in snow but in the least try and get a feel for the ergonomics of the controls. Play around with both and see which one feels easiest and most comfortable to operate. It's not real world conditions but it's better than buying a machine without getting some sort of feel for how the controls work and operate.

while in my opinion both machines will perform well theres no doubt there,  with that said l would go with the bigger motor everytime. l own my own small engine repair business and customer ask this question all the time, and one of the biggest compliant l get is lack of power.

Take a good look at the new machines and compare the quality to your old one. I think you'll find yours was much better built. Unless you've got a severe rust problem or it's falling apart, you can renovate and repower your old machine for less than the cost of a new one.

I thought about that but I think my old blower is too far gone.

If you want the Best check out the HONDA  HS 1132TAS or the HS 928TAS Heavy 2 stage Snowblowers they have a Hydrostatic Transmission and no maintenance intenisve 'Friction Wheel' Drive System. You Get what you pay for.

"no maintenance intenisve 'Friction Wheel' Drive System."

Surely you jest.

I looked up the specs for you. Toro $1,400 has only a  26" wide clearing width and only a 14" tall auger. It has a 250CC engine to drive the 221 lb machine and blow snow at the same time. The auger will chop packed snow but  not ice at the end of the driveway like the Honda 928 series.

The Toro and the Ariens use the same $277 engine. Toro doesn't list if the auger handle interlocks with the drive handle nor does it list a heavy duty gear box so it must use a cheaper one. The Ariens has the heavy duty gearbox and clears to 28" wide but has the small 14" tall auger. Both of these lower cost snow blowers use the old pressure plate system as do the John Deere and Craftsman to drive the wheels. These less expensive blowers have the old hand clutch to shift into the 6 forward and 2 reverse speeds. So your constantly shifting, using  at least 3 of the forward speeds and both reversew speeds. The Honda hydrostatic drive has no clutch, no shifting. It  has a variable speed joystick like lever for forward or reverse. 

These snow blowers advertise 45-50 ft throw but that is light powder snow. If you have a long wide driveway you should spend a couple hundred more and get the Ariens Delux 30" because it jumps the engine size from 250 cc to either the 287 or 305 CC optional engines.

As mentioned above if you want to avoid the shifting, eliminate systems with pressure plates that slip with dirt or melting snow, then upgrade to the Honda series with the Hydrostatic drive. The advanced drive system eliminates the friction disc on pressure plate that needs to be clean and dry. No annual cleaning of the pressure disk and no cable stretch issues etc that cost you plenty of service calls just when you need the snow blower. The better engine and high tech drive system with ice breaking 20" tall auger cost alittle more $ $2,579. You can get good discounts by buying in  the fall, some snow blowers advertised $500 dollars off, pre-season sale.  The 4 cycle Honda engine and thrower gear ratios  throws even the heavy wet snow  50 feet.. Bought it in 2003 no repairs, starts easily to the present Jan 2011.  

For long straight driveways you may want to consider the tractor tread design instead of wheels with chains. This unit has the best traction and has a pedal to select the height. Touch the pedal and raise or lower the handle to the desired height and your done. This is the only system that you can use on stone driveways, The side skids drag and lift the decorator stones into the chute. The snow chute is metal, not plastic!  If you have a stone driveway, like mine or an old lumpy paved driveway then the tractor tread design is perfect.  When you do the sidewalks , depress the  pedal and raise the handle so the blower scrapes the pavement clean. All the other systems have side skid plates that have to be adjusted with a wrench!  I tried to  be objective and have owned three other brands but will never change from my Honda. 

JGtravelor

Do you have any pictures of your 2003 Honda HS928 snowblower you can share with us?

New_Yorker wrote:

While I agree with your assessment of the Honda, great units, just bought a Yamaha, very similar specs, I don't understand your comment about 'maintenance intensive Friction Wheels'. My MTD is 14 years old, and in that 14 years, the maintenance amounted to a cleaning and Lubrication, during shutdown, at the end of the year! It still has the original parts in it, and I used to have 15x50 driveway, and clear about 100 feet of the Crescent for parking. Not sure what you were using, but I don't think your experience is typical?

JGtravelor,

You sound so much like NJDavid and New_Yorker.  BTW: Your Ariens snowblower video was pretty good.  Looks like the friction disk on the Ariens was working just fine. 

MN_Runner wrote:

I think that video was done by a different anal-retentive guy, not DavidNJ who complained about his MTD and then went out and bought another one. If I had that many complaints about a product I wouldn't go and buy another one.

rubinew wrote:
I'd say that 95% of friction wheel powered snow throwers work flawlessly for the life of the machine.  

Anyone making statements that friction wheel systems are unreliable and/or maintenance intensive are exhibiting their ignorance.  They know not of what they speak.

And, by the way, I'd bet that Yamaha will soundly spank any equivalent Honda in every imaginable operational aspect.   There's a new king in the snow blower world and it's painted blue.  

Why are you pitting Yamaha against Honda?  The RED is trying to get along with the BLUE and learn to coexist without name calling and incorrectly referring certain terminology that is totally irrelevent.

I have the Ariens Deluxe 2 Stage 28 inch.  It's built like a tank. It's a great machine.  I considered the Toro you're referring to but ultimately went with Ariens.  Given the opportunity again, I'd make the same decision.  Both the Toro and Ariens are fine machines.  However, with its all steel construction, the Ariens felt like it  had more of a solid feel to it than the Toro...a better build quality over all you could say...that's the perception I had.   Also, if the Ariens has a more powerful engine, then the choice is clear, go with the Ariens. 

MN_Runner, if you google GC vx GX you'll get some good info.

>>>MN_RUNNER, "Why are you pitting Yamaha against Honda?"

Borat hates Honda.  Blue was the greatest thing to come down the pike for turning a Honda hater into a Honda basher at the slightest oppertunity. 

Borat dosen't open his wallet that much and has to treat it with anti-sieze so it won't lock up.  The cost of a Honda or Yamaha would give him a heart attack.  His was under doctors orders to get a snowblower to replace the shovel or he never would have bought one.  

>>> There's a new king in the snow blower world and it's painted blue.

   Well sort of.  There are big Hondas out there we don't see.  What about those to Blue? 

>>>Yamaha will soundly spank any equivalent Honda.

"Equivalent Honda"?

  If you're going to stop at the HS1132 that's not the "equivalent Honda".    Take the HS1132.  Is that the "equivalent Honda"?  Bucks wise, power wise, build wise & etc.  There are a lot of considerations for comparison.   It would be tough to consider, "I'd bet that  in every imaginable operational aspect." to be true without knowing more about the Yamaha.  If you know what's under the hood post it.  Which model are you comparing to what Blue?  I can't find much other than marketing lit on the net.

>>>There's a new king in the snow blower world and it's painted blue. 

So the question is what is the "equivalent Honda"?  Are you drawing the line at HS828, HS928, HS1132 or what? 

I love the guys on here that are all about Honda machines. While no one will doubt that they are great, the OP is looking in the low $1k price range and asking about 2 particular machines. Someone almost always comes on who loves and/or owns a Honda and suggests they spend almost 3x the money that they were asking the question about. If they were considering spending close to $3k on a machine I'm sure they would have posted that in the first place.

I am perfectly happy with my $700 Ariens, and while some may scoff at it's lack of headlight, differential, non heated grips and small engine it does the job well enough for my needs. To me I was not crazy with the chute mechanism on the deluxe (ice drill I think it's called), I just found it kind of awkward to reach over the control panel to crank the chute. Had the deluxe had the same quick turn chute on the compacts I might have considered it. The toro stick does look pretty slick although I've never actually used one other than playing around in the stores.

It would appear that the Honda aficionados might be feeling a little inadequate. 

Maybe now we'll be hearing a little less crowing about the "end all and be all Honda".

A refreshing change.  'Bout time.

trouts2 wrote:

http://www.honda.co.jp/snow/products/hss970i_1170i.html

That's the Honda equivalent.

I had a similar decision to make last month.  I ended up going with the Toro 826 two stage.  So far, it's been a beautiful machine.  Very well-balanced, fast, blows the snow a long way, and really easy to turn.   I tried out an Ariens platinum deluxe before choosing.  It's a nice machine too but tougher to move even with the auto differential lock.

The issue that I have with Honda and Yamaha is that they keep their best machines for the Japanese market.  Over here we have to muscle and jerk their heavy tracked machines around...but in Japan they have dual hydro driven tracks to turn their high end machines. 

Paul7,

The main reason we have big and brute versions of Yamaha and Honda is that we, North Americans, are physically stronger and can handle the weight.  Average japanese is around 5'5" with a weigjt of 130 lb.  On other hand, we north americans are around 5'10" and weigh around 200 lb.   So the japanese market demands fancier models but less likely to die from a heart attack since they are conditioned to insane prices.

Borat,

Before going to a Yamaha dealer, please carry a defibrillator with you in case you develop a deleterious VF.  We need your voice in this forum. 

Borat,

When you buy a Yamaha, please let us know. I will not wait for that special event.

 >>the OP is looking in the low $1k price range

I think the original poster is long gone and the thread done.

>>tkrotchko

   That's what I was looking for and I believe there are models above that looking like a Durango.  The place one would be sure to find high end pictures of Honda machines is Borat's dartboard. 

OK Borat where's the beef?   Your dissing on Honda at every oppertunity.  Here's your chance to plant the flag.   What's so great about which Yamaha compared to which equivalent Honda?  I've had, used and worked on several Yamahas and think they are fantastic.  I've now worked on 3 Honda and think they are fantastic.  I would lean somewhat to Yamaha for a few reasons on the years and models I know but I don't know the newer Honda or Yamaha.  Your help to unmask the wonders of the Yamaha to compare with the cheaply built Honda that would never tempt you wipe the dust off the conbination lock to the vault would be of assistance to educate the homeless guys at the library.

JGtravelor<<<< Didn't he get booted?

 

MN_Runner wrote:
I believe Borat has in the past stated he expects his Simplicity to be the last machine he'll ever have to buy (or something like that). With proper maintenance (which I'm sure he does) I don't see any reason to expect otherwise.

Bill_H wrote:
It's OK Bill.

The Honda boys are just crying in their beer.

Just hand them a tissue.......

By the way, you're right.  I doubt I will need anything more than the machine I have.  Might pick up a used Toro single stage for light duty work.  Other than that, as you've suggested, the Simplicity will likely last many, many, years. 

trouts2 wrote:

Trouts, I agree that likely the OP is long gone and has likely made a purchase by now but I was just getting commenting on the issue that someone asks a question about certain types of machines they are thinking of and someone usually responds with "Honda's rule and are awesome" or something along those lines. No doubt they are great machines and I would like to have one but I don't think that they are the best solution to everyone's situation.

I must admit that prior to buying my Ariens I cruised these forums looking for advice and suggestions from prior posts and that helped me in purchase. For one, prior to checking out the Ariens line at HD, I was pretty unfamiliar with them and if someone asked me what type of snow blower they should buy I would have likely said go to sears and get a craftsman. I do see quite a lot of them around and have to admit I owned one myself, but I guess thats called being unknowledgeable in a subject. I think that there are some very experienced people on this forum with a great deal of worthwhile opinions and smarts about OPE, and then there are others like myself that are just trying to get some help and offer some assistance where possible. While I am not a wiz with snow blowers I do know a little about small engines and tinkering around is a bit of a hobby, so I may not be in a position to offer an opinion on every thread in here, but it gets a little old with people just throwing 2cents in about Honda, Yamaha, etc when a person like me may not be able to devote $2k + to a machine that only gets used a few times a year depending on where you live. This is not to say that the red and blue claims may not be without merit but my opinion is that they may be machines better to suited to someone elses need. It's kind of like going to a car forum and asking about a corolla or a civic and the only answer you get is...BMW is the ultimate driving machine.

Just my 2cents

Borat,

How about a Yamaha single stage?  It is just too bad Yamaha does not make one as you would buy one in a heart beat.  Honda Yukios might be a good choice.

Incidentally, the "equivalent Honda" I mentioned is about $6,600 US list. I suspect the high price has a lot more to do with why they don't import it. As is, my Honda dealer doesn't stock any tracked models, and will only stock the 928 because that's about the top of the market for a snowblower in the United States. In Japan, if you need a snowblower, you're a government agency, business owner or you're extremely wealthy; my impression is that owning a couple acres isn't very common in Japan, but I think it is quite common in the United States, so the need for any snowblower is very small in that country (despite the heavy snows).

shiva,

Just to honor you, I will neither talk about Honda not Yamaha for the remainder of the day.  I like to hear more about your snowblower experiences (all aspects good, ugly and bad).

tkrotchko wrote:
Actually I don't think that one is equivalent to anything sold in North America by either company.  The hybrid Hondas have the easy turn feature.

MN_Runner wrote:
This is as close as they come....only in Japan of course.

http://www.yamaha-motor.jp/snowthrower/lineup/yu240/operation/

 

Shiva916. 

I have not noticed stepping up so much.  Maybe I'm missing it.  There is suggestions to stay clear of lower quality and pointing out the worth to "invest" in a better machine and why.  I don't see one brand particullary favored outside of a handfull of posters who post about their machine over all others.   

Many inquires are about A vs B and C or and often posts with a price cap.  Some posts stray but in general the bulk focus on the original question and bring info to the thread.   So you take an average and toss out the extreams in posts.  There will be answers to the left, right and on target.  

 So the point you mentioned is somewhat valid and happens on all forums.  The overall postings have good info and plodding through the haze goes with the nature of forums. 

Paul7 wrote:
Not a single stage, but I'll take it!

Ever notice how clean the snow is in Japan?  Even the end of driveway snow is pristine! 

I wonder if the beautiful model is included with the blower purchase?

Paul7 wrote:

Wow, that little Yamaha actually thows the snow pretty far for the size!!!

Rest of the Thread:

As for comparing the Honda to Yamaha, up here in Canuck Land, we have access to both, and very equal models. The YS928J and the HS928TCD are very similar in size, function, and price.

I just found that there are a few extra Features with the Yamaha, that were not available on the Honda. Since Yamaha was gone from Canada for 15 years, and just came back last year, I suspect that Honda did what they want, with no competition in the High end market. I expect with Yamaha now back, we will see some changes to the offerings from Honda.'

It would actually be a good thing if Yamaha entered the U.S. market, it would likely push Honda to offer some of the other features they have. 

Then again, as someone pointed out, track drives may not be as popular in the U.S. and that Honda dealers hardly bring in the Track models. Yet in Saskatchewan, that is all the Honda Dealer brings in, is Track drives, no wheeled, you have to order it if you want one.

I don't even see a wheeled 2 stage offer from Yamaha, so that might be another reason they avoid the U.S. market, just speculation.

As far as what the OP needs, he did mention drifting, so if it is high, hard packed, and happens often, then a track drive may not be a stretch for him.  If it is rare, and mostly fallen snow, then likely several cheaper models will serve him well. I used a $900 MTD for 14 years, worked great in the city, at previous house. Now, I need track, and my wife wanted the battery start, and the HydroDrive, so here I am, with a Yamaha. If you try to get those features with other brands, you get very close to $3k, so it made sense to spend another $500 and get the Yamaha Quality. I know, that if I am not home, and my wife needs to use it, it will work, no fuss!!

rubinew wrote:

My wife wants to try out your Yamaha!

Steve_Cebu wrote:

So that's what she said, eh?

sounds like a good opportunity to upgrade.

MN & trouts, please don't take me the wrong way, I think that all members opinions are great to be voiced on these boards as thats what keeps them going and as great as they are. Obviously with any forum community you will get members that favor particular brands over others. Since getting my particular machine I think it's quite nice and will sing it's praises as much as anyone else if I were asked, but I also would not rule out any other type of machine were my needs to change or if somene asked me for an opinion about different machines.

Maybe it's just me, but some members seem so biased that if anyone mentions a machine other than the one that they love reguardless of the content of the post or what the OP may be looking to answer the response will be that "you should just buy XXXX machine it's the best" with little else. While this will happen in any kind of discussion and forum of any kind I just happened to see it on quite a few posts that I was looking at; and not to say it's limited to Honda, or Yamaha, but there are also Ariens fanatics as well. I think this is a very valuable website and with many very knowledgeable members as I have said before. I know first hand as this site actually helped me in my purchase.

Off topic a bit, and not that I think I would ever pony up the money for it but has anyone heard of Yamaha being sold in the US market again? And as far as the big Honda machines not being sold in the US market, you would think that certain parts of this country certainly would receive enough snow to justify one of these monsters. I kinda wish I had one just to blast out my driveway in like 10 mins, and bury the neighbors in the process. Just for laughs, then I could go blow them out too.  Don't want to be thought of as that guy....lol

Steve_Cebu wrote:

Actually, My wife gets first try, maybe tomorrow, I am going on a road trip for a couple days, so I'll have to show her how it works, take her first test run!

shiva916 wrote:

I know what you mean.  Especially when someone has already purchased a particular machine and is looking for help to solve a problem they're having.  At that point if someone replies with. "Well you should have bought a Toro, or Honda, or Ariens, etc...without ever addressing their issue, I'm thinking why bother replying at all.  It's a bit of a different story if someone is looking for advice on what purchase to make of course. 

shiva916 wrote:

I think that as one of the Toro fanatics I'm pretty well balanced.  I think every machine has a place. Toro has it's advantages but so don't Ariens, Simplicity, Honda and other brands. There is little to no info posted on Toro 2 stages here, compared to Ariens.

So i try and balance the scales a bit. I did own a Honda 928TAS but returned it.

I think that Yamaha is very expensive but it is the Ferrari of snowblowers and it's not sold here in the US so it's exotic. If it was sold here it would become like Honda after a few years. Desireable but too dear for most of us to buy.

rubinew wrote:

I'm sure she'll have fun with it.

Paul7 wrote:

Oh c'mon I did put a   in there. I didn't think people were so serious.

I wasn’t necessarily thinking of you Steve.  But more so when someone is looking for a snow blower, has a $1,000 budget and someone recommends a $3,000 machine.  Yes the more expensive machine is better and will get the job done quicker but why stop there.  Why not recommend spending $20,000 more to get a Bobcat...it’s better and even faster.  Point is neither recommendation is of any use to the poster.

By the way I don’t know if you remember but I was the one who advised you to pay the restocking fee to return the Honda and get the Toro.  Seemed like the better fit for you and especially your wife. 

Paul7 wrote:

Oh I agree with what you just said if their budget is $1K and you suggest a $2K unit that's not gooing to work at all. I did see a Bobcat today owned by the city with a snowblower attachment (envy) But that's overkill for most people's needs.

The thing is it costs nothing to try out all the machines at the various dealers that fall within the buyers budget. What is a factor for one person or even a dealbreaker like the Honda was for my wife, another person might not even notice.

But there are good brands and crap brands and good and bad within the good brands themselves. Toro and Hondas leaking fuel for example. Both good machines but not perfect.

I recall your suggesting that and I really do appreciate it.  Now my wife is will spend time and gas doing the entire driveway herself tomorrow for practice. We had about 2 inches of powder last night. I might or might not take any videos. She never could have done the driveway with the Honda. Now she's eager to use the Toro. ....and since we've no where to go..... Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow.

Good to see it looks like others may have felt the same way i did. Not to single out anyone in particular, and i think it's great that some people will go all out to show brand loyalty but it tends to make post quickly get off topic.

Steve...lucky man that the Mrs. wants to get out there and use your toro, mine only looks at it and says that its in the way.  I shouldn't say that, on the first storm that i used it out I got her to make about 2 passes down the driveway, then she thought it was kind of fun. Sorta like all sorts of chores, seems kinda fun at first, but it quickly gets old. Although I can't say the task seems old yet with the new machine. With my last junker it truly was a crummy task. I guess thats what a better piece of machinery will do for you.

For me, operating a good running machine tossing snow 35 to 40 feet, never gets old.   I really enjoy it.  However, on the flip side, an unreliable piece of junk dribbling snow down the side of the machine is anything but fun.

borat wrote:
+1

If I can toss it from my lawn back to the driveway without the neighbors watching, I'd do it too. 

shiva916 wrote:

Thanks, she's a great gal, The only problem is we have a lot of sun this morning and it's all melted for the most part. I think she can do the EOD but other than that there isn't much left for her to blow. I think it's because the Toro is very easy to use compared to others that we tried/bought. The twin trigger steering should be an industry wide standard IMO. It makes it so easy. The quick chute is very fast and easy. I think if we still had the Honda I'd be out there myself with her filming but not using it.