Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I was reading about the Clarence impeller improvement online today. It attaches a rubber gasket to each impeller blade ceiling it against impeller housing. Most who tried it seemed to report outstanding results especially with heavy wet snow. The only place where some reported it may not be effective were on units, such as the Honda, that reportedly have very tight clearances tween the impeller blades and the housing from the factory.

Ariens snowblowers are well-known for their high-capacity high capacity. Well most large snowblowers at 12 inch diameter impellers, the Ariens have 14 inch. That is over 16% faster speed at the end of the impeller blade. Does that give them a decisive edge?

So the question is: how important is the design of the impeller to the overall system performance? Are tight clearances between the impeller and it's housing critical? If so, which brands have the tightest ones? Is the diameter of the impeller critical? If so, did he Ariens and others with large impellers have a distinct advantage? The Clarence kit is inexpensive if you can install it yourself. Should everybody be installing these kits? TheToro has a unique impeller housing. Partially plastic, it has a return for excess snow to be returned to scoop. The effective Toro and edge or is it a disadvantage?

Toro: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTAAaT_sFss

DavidNJ wrote:
Have you ever used one? It doesn't sound like you have.

I live in an area that gets hit hard with snow. Honda's are everywhere here and they are awesome machines! The best performance,quality and reliability in the business. Yamaha is the only thing that comes close.

Having said that, I will not be buying one. That is only because I can't afford it, but if you have the money and live in an area that gets enough snowfall to justify it, its well worth the money.

Well, Honda doesn't tout their snowblowers are professional grade.  They have no affiliation with GMC so no need to ride on the coat tails of that marketing effort.

What Honda does state is that it is commercial.  Here's a cut and paste from their website:

Commercial grade components

It's all about the details. Honda snowblowers are built to last.

Just look at our two-stage snowblowers. 

• Legendary Honda GX series commercial engines
• Commercial grade hydrostatic drive
• Durable metal chutes and auger housings
• Heavy duty bronze gear on the chute rotation rod
• Large ball bearing on our engine PTO
• Heavy duty auger gear drive, constructed of steel helical cut gears, supported by high quality ball bearings
• Low pressure tires on wheel models – no need for tire chains

The list goes on and on.  And unlike our competitors, we don’t skimp on our smaller models.  The HS724 has the same grade of components as our HS1132.

You can dispute that other brands may have thicker metal here and there that makes it more "tough" or "commercial".  But it's not just about weight and thickness, unless you're into abusing and ramrodding your precious equipment, but also intelligent use of design and material selection.  I would rate Honda first in this regard, followed closely behind by Toro, and then Simplicity/Deere.  However, in terms of user friendliness, the order changes significantly.  Toro leads first, then Simplicity/Deere, and Honda at somewhere near the bottom of all the other brands.  Combine Honda's engineering with Toro's user friedliness and you got an awesome machine. 

Forget about competing in prices so you can get into doors of Walmart, Home Depot, or Lowes.  At the present, I cannot say how Honda and Toro remain to sell their product at their prices, but they do.  Maybe they are focused and determined in their strategy.  You cannot find a Honda product cheaper in the big box stores, period.  Companies that produces premium products usually enforce price control and restrict or limit internet sales, which is very effective against brand erosion, and makes it attractive for dealers to carry their product. 

DavidNJ wrote:
I wouldn't say Huyndai left Honda way behind in automotive engineering.  Toyota yes, Honda no.

Trying not to stray off topic, but if Huyndai made snowblowers, I would have problem identifying what it is.  Their crooked H looks like a Honda emblem, and I'm pondering if the exterior styling is a Nissan, Lexus, or a Mercedes.  Take a look at the current Huyndai Sonata and Genesis.  I almost mistaken the Huyndai Genesis as a baby Bentley or an Aston Martin.  Both Sonata and Genesis are good cars in it's own right at a good price, or so the automotive Kool-Aid have brainwashed me, but both cars have an identity crisis.  Outlet malls and designer perfume knock offs comes to mind.

Okay, back on topic.  You go Huyndai !!!.  Honda could use some competition in the snowblower business.  :)  Just don't make it look like a HondAriensToroDeere.

aa335 wrote:
They call it commercial grade, ariens calls it professional grade, simplicity and toro probably put some other names on it, but thats besides the point. All I meant was that when comparing pricing, you have to compare the honda to other companies absolute top end models. Honda is still more, but the gap is far less and the honda is still the better machine. Sure the others might have some bells and whistles the honda doesn't have. But people don't buy them for bells and whistles, they buy them because they want the premium workhorse in snow removal.

Have you ever noticed that almost every snowblower "comparison" type posting uses Honda as the benchmark that all others are measured against? I guess that kind of tells the story right there... And oh yeah, you definitely have to try one in a real good storm to appreciate the engineering and build quality of a Honda snowblower. I'm not saying the others are not any good as I appreciate all OPE, it's just that Honda quality has always been top notch without any gimmicks or slogans, etc...

FrankMA wrote:

I don't recall anyone using Honda as a benchmark and have yet to see and objective report. The catalog never mentions steering and it appears the 'remote' shute control is twirling a crank an unknown number of turns.  http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/pdf/Brochures/snowblower_brochure.pdf

The engines are OHV not OHC, not that big, and of moderate performance: http://engines.honda.com/models/model-detail/gx270 . IMHO the Subaru snow motors have better designs and specs; can't comment on construction although technicians who I've talked to also say they are better.

The only thing that Honda seems to have is a focus on impeller speed:

1. "In addition to the flat paddle auger used to discharge snow on our single-stage snowblower, Honda two-stage snowblowers come equipped with a fast spinning impeller in the discharge duct that throws snow faster and farther."
2. "single lever accurately adjusts ground speed without affecting auger rotation speed."

How is this a superior machine?

DavidNJ wrote:
Honda does not have steering, fixed axle left to right wheels, none.  That's why they don't mention it.

The chute crank takes about 8 turns for full left right.  It is a worm gear at the end of a crank handle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U6yQESTtJo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHNLbAW6j7k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWy7iaKWBVU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BihUW8eCTis&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/user/lezart123#p/a/u/0/oxSFgHcIkcM

Sounds pretty inferior. Why would someone think it is better? Did they also vote for Obama/Pelosi?

DavidNJ wrote:
Engine, transmission, track drive, build quality, reliability and performance are all the best in the business.

I don't know what you think you can interpret out of paper stats. Honda's reputation for building the best snowblowers is based on actual experience, its a proven machine that has been around a long time. It has nothing to do with their great reputation for other products like you said in another post. Thats just nonsense. I don't know what it is you have against them. All I can say is get some real life experience in harsh climates with various different machines and you'll see why honda is king in places that need the most out of a snowblower(get crap loads of snow all winter long).

giocam wrote:

No evidence for any of the claims. The engine doesn't appear to be anything special. Where is it made. Ditto the transmission. To the best of my knowledge there is no data on build quality and reliablity across brands. In cars, Honda is more mid-pack these days.

That leave performance. I looked at the videos. The think is SLOW. In all the videos the snow blower seemed slower than nearly every other brand in videos. And that was with it s rather narrow widths. As far as throwing, look at the videos. It is shooting a rather small load out at high speed. You can tell that by how tight the spread is as it leaves the chute and how far it goes before it spreads.

We already determined it has a very awkward chute direction control and no steering making it very hard to manuvuer. In the videos everyone was going straight. In one an 17 year old or so was wrestling with it.

It seems like an undesigned over priced product with misleading advertising using a multi-product brand image to deceive consumers.