Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

Hello everybody,

This is my first post. I found this website about a week ago and have been trying to learn from all the great info posted here. I'm 54 and live in northeast Wisconsin on a large corner lot right across the road from Lake Michigan (can you say "lake effect snow"?) My driveway is 3 cars wide and a little over 2 car lengths long, with a row of hedges bordering it on one side and an alley on the other. When I clear the snow, I can't throw snow into the alley, so I need to throw it across the 3 car wide driveway clear to the other side (and over the hedges, which are about 4 feet high). Also, I live on a busy street where the city plows are constantly coming by and pushing more snow onto the sidewalks, which are very long.

The last 2 winters have been very harsh in terms of both snow and cold. I've been shopping at all the stores around where I live trying to find a snow thrower that will fit my needs. Reliability and quality is high on the list of what I'm looking for. I've read good things about the Simplicity brand, so I visited a Simplicity dealer near me. The salesperson I dealt with suggested that the L1428E would be the machine to best serve my needs. I love the Easy Turn feature. The one feature that I question is the electric chute controls ... especially without any kind of manual override should it freeze up or short out ... or whatever.

My question: Is there any reason I should be leery about having electric chute controls? As I said, our winters can be very cold and harsh here. I'd hate to have the button freeze up on me or short out in the middle of a blizzard and have no means of clearing the snow if that should happen. I wouldn't mind dropping to the model below this one (the L1226E), which has a manual chute control, if it can still do the job with less chance of problems arising.

Oh, and one more thing. There is also a Snapper dealer in my area. According to him, Snapper is the parent company of Simplicity. So does that mean Snapper would be a better product than Simplicity? Or would they be the same machine with a different name tag on it? They offer what appears to be a very similar snow thrower to the L1428E for the same price (it even has the exact same model number) ... accept that their machine also includes hand warmers (which in my mind isn't really necessary, but I'm just letting you know).

Thanks everybody. I look forward to your opinions and feedback.

Bob

Hi Bob -- You've come to an excellent forum. There are some really knowledgeable people here and they love to help. Regarding your question -- ha! -- you've hit on a nerve here. And you're going to get tens of replies in both directions. Briggs and Stratton, by the way, is the parent of Simplicity and Snapper.

Here's my two-cents... I've had a Simplicity Signature Pro for a few years now and I've never had a single problem with the electric chute rotation control. The motor is a simple, but effective windshield wiper motor. The gearing is actually simpler than a manual control. As such, it's no more likely to freeze up than a worm-gear, rod, and several linkages. I make a habit of spraying WD-40 on a couple parts of the machine after each use to prevent any freeze issues -- I include the chute rotation switch in that list.

That said, stuff happens. So... generally speaking, if you simply do not want the motorized rotation or if you have machine-shop style tools and skills that make you prefer non-motorized controls and solutions, don't get it. If you are comfortable with and/or prefer switches, wires, and motors, do get it.

To me, it's quite extraordinary to think that one set up is more or less likely to fail than the other.

Thank you very much for your reply. I don't mean to rehash what has already been covered here or to press anybody's hot buttons. Being a member in other forums, I know how it is having to answer the same questions over and over again. I'll just assume that this is an issue that might not have a definite answer ... that it comes down to personal preference.

I am still interested in people's thoughts on whether the model below this one (L1226E) is worth considering for my needs, although that one doesn't have the Easy Turn feature which I think would be really nice since I have to go up and down the length of a 3 car wide driveway quite a few times. I really do like the manual chute control on that model too. It seems so easy compared to other manual cranks on other machines.

I'm still also curious to know if the Simplicity and the Snapper model numbers L1428E are basically the same machine, but with only a different label slapped on them. (As I mentioned in my first post, the Snapper dealer told me that the Snapper version has hand warmers. From what I remember, the Simplicity and Snapper sure looked the same to me on the outside.)

Okay, I'll sit back for a while and let people respond if they like, without butting in again. Thanks ahead of time.

You might check their websites.  Only the big, XL Snapper has hand grips, according to their online specs.  And it only comes in one, very wide, clearing width.  Simplicity's Signature Pro line has hand warmers on all clearing widths.  These 'Pro' machines also sport a beefier frame and some other bells and whistles.  Hand warmers are, of course, totally unnecessary, but they sure are nice!  (You might also look at the Toro machines and Ariens, IF you have good dealers near by.  For me, a few years back, it came down to Toro vs Simplicity and it was dealer support... followed by the Briggs OHV engine that broke the tie.)

Easy Turn is worth it, I wouldn't get any machine that is lacking some sort of remote wheel unlock feature.  And generally, I think you'll find good advice on this forum to buy as much power as you can afford.  You won't regret it when the first heavy snow hits.  That trumps any bell, whistle, or gizmo for that matter.

You might want to check out an Ariens dealer as well.  First of all being in NE Wisconsin its always good to support the local economy and Ariens blowers are built right near you.  Seeing what you are looking for and your concern over electric chute rotation and ease of turning you might want to look at the Ariens Deluxe Platinums.  I believe the chute and deflector rotation on those are all mechanical.  The Ariens Deluxe Platinums also have automatic traction control which unlocks either wheel automatically when turning unlike the Simplicity system which requires operator input and only unlocks one wheel.  One less lever to freeze up. 

have you looked at Toro's?...I recently did alot of shopping, looking at Simplicity, Ariens, and Toro's, and i chose the Toro 828 OXE.  It has great chute controls, and is built solid.  I would at least take a look.

The snapper and simplicity large frames are the same machine except snapper uses a plastic chute.Briggs and Stratton own both of them.Also those machines get their snow series max engines.Toro and Ariens get the snow series engine.They r going to save the better engine for snapper and simplicity since briggs owns them.You might find a left over simplicity w/out the electric chute rotator.I own a simplicity signature pro 11570e with the manual chute rotator.It was siitting right next to a pro model with the electric chute rotator same width.But I said to myself,my wife will kill me if I spend $1900 on a snowblower and the chute wont rotate lol.If its 4 am and I'm trying to clear my driveway,I dont have time to figure out if its a loose wire or the motor is bad etc.I need reliabilty not a doo dad.Look at Honda machines sold in the usa.Clean ,simple and gadget free.Theres always Toro which seems to be an easier machine to move around than ariens.But you should go in the stores and see which one you feel more comfortable with.

First of all I would like to say hi to the forum.  I have lingered around for a couple months and finally became a member.  This place is a very valuable source of information.  Thanks to everyone who contributes.

Some things to clear up (kind of):

Snow Series Max engines are used on all Toro, some Ariens and some Simplicity/Snapper models.  When I was shopping for my thrower I looked at a simplicity L1226E and thought it had a max engine too.  Can't be sure.  On the snapper/simplicity website it says that every large frame model higher than the L1226E has a Snow Series Max Engine but not the L1226E.  For Ariens its hard to see what egnine they use but I am guessing they also use Max engines from deluxe24 and upwards.  Maybe Snowmann can clear this up?  Since it looks like you will be purchasing a bigger machine anyways it is safe to assume that you will have the better engine.

I think you should look at some Ariens throwers and then Toro if you have the money.  When I was deciding between a Toro, Ariens, and Simplicity the electric chute rotation was the deal breaker.  I think that Simplicity/Briggs is using these motors to cut costs, since its cheaper to put a motor on instead of fabricating all kinds of linkages that need to have a degree of percision to work.  I don't think the electric motors will fail, but I'm just a person that likes it simple.  I know, I basically just contradicted myself!  I guess new technology is always hard to accept.  (Simple is also the reason I went with a locked axle Toro 826OE but this is besides the point)

My humble opinions:

-All three companies will provide you pretty much a simillar quality product at the end of the day.
-If taken care of all three companies have a product that will last a long, long time.
-Toros are nice but extremely expensive.  Unless you can get a good deal or can afford it.
-I would go for the remote wheel unlock (both Ariens and Simplicity) over the Ariens automatic differential.

-Especially if you are not mechanically inclined: it is important to buy from a good dealer above all else.

Hope this helps a bit and good luck!

If toro uses the snow series max engine how come they dont mention it?The website does not mention snow series max .I would think u would highlight that point.

Only Snapper/Simplicity clearly define the engines they use.  Unless the label is wrong, my Toro 826OE (bottom of lineup) has a Snow Series Max 1150 Engine.  Ariens definitely uses these engines too, I just don't know where they introduce them in their product line.  They don't specify on their website.  I tried comparing pictures but that didn't work.

Actually, according to Snowmann Ariens gets better engines than the other two, but I can't substantiate his claims.

now does that make sense ope??B&S owns snapper and simplicity but they r going to give their machines the lesser of the two engines as opposed to ariens??

mikiewest wrote:

They don't give their engines to anyone.  They sell them.  Briggs and Stratton is an engine company first that happens to own a couple small equipment manufacturers too.  If Toro or Ariens is going to pay what Briggs asks for the better engines, I don't see why Briggs wouldn't sell them.  Both Toro and Ariens buy a lot of engines every year and it wouldn't make sense for Briggs to jeopordize big contracts like that just to sell a few more snow blowers every year.

Thanks for all the hellos and the great info! I really appreciate the help.

With all the high praise the Toros are getting, I'd like to check them out. But I don't know of any Toro dealers in the area. I went to the Toro website, but their "Dealer Locator" feature isn't compatible with the browser I use. (grrr) I also checked the yellow pages. No mention of Toros in the Snow Removal section. I guess I'll have to ask around.

I did look at a few Ariens snow throwers/blowers at a Home Depot store about 30 miles from where I live. The salesman "helping" me didn't seem to know very much about any of the snow throwers. Most questions I asked were answered with "I don't know". And out of the questions that were answered, I had the feeling that the salesman really didn't know the answers, but had to say something since I asked. Frustrating.

My head is spinning with all the info from here plus all the different snow throwers I looked at over the last week or so ... most of which haven't even been mentioned here (... like Craftsman, Poulan, Cub Cadet, Sno-Tek, Troy-Bilt, MTD, etc.). From what is mentioned here, I'm assuming that Toro, Ariens and Simplicity/Snapper are all highly regarded so that's what I'm concentrating most on. (Plus I'm not sure about any machine with a plastic chute, but I suppose that's another one of those hot-button issues). :-)

Lots of variables to sort through. It might take me some time to figure out, but again, I do appreciate all your help. That's why I came here.

Thanks again!

Bob

Go ahead and ask all you want. Anytime a newby comes by and ask questions, all sorts of "hot buttons" pops up.

Good Luck -- let us know how it works out and what you end up with.  One thought on finding a Toro dealer...  I live in the metro-Milwaukee area and have noticed that several of the ACE Hardware stores are also Toro dealers.  Maybe the same is true up by you? 

mfduffy wrote:
Thanks. I'm in the Door County area. I found a Toro dealer in Green Bay yesterday. Nice looking machines. I've never really paid attention to the details on snow blowers before. Now that I've been looking around, it's an eye opener to see so many different options out there. It won't be an easy decision.

The other brands you mentioned aren't exactly trash. As the saying goes, You get what you pay for. The AYP/MTD machines and their derivatives will perform well under normal circumstances with reasonable maintenance. However, as the other old saying goes, When the going gets tough, the tough get going. Loosely translated means that the higher quality machines will knuckle down and keep going where the other machines struggle. A good example of this was when we had a nasty early spring storm March 31st of this year. We received 30 inches of heavy wet snow. The end of driveway deposit was at least 48 inches. My Simplicity 9528 powered through all of it. I'm not saying it was a breeze. It wasn't. However, the machine performed impressively and didn't miss a beat. My neighbour up the street had her vehicle stuck at the bottom of her drive way (110' long, two cars wide and a 10 per cent uphill grade to the house, much like all the lots on this side of the street.) She had come home during the storm and quite a bit of snow had already accumulated and although, her vehicle is a four wheel drive Rav4, it couldn't make it up the drive way. I saw her shoveling around the Rav with her 10 h.p. 29 inch late model Craftsman parked in about three feet of wet snow near the bottom. I walked over to offer assistance. She said that she was shoveling because the snow thrower had died. I saw that it just needed fuel and gassed it up. Then I went to work using it to start clearing her driveway. I couldn't believe how much more difficult it was using the Craftsman. It's not that I don't have experience with them. I had previously owned two very similar sized/powered machines. After struggling to make just two passes of unpacked snow, I parked it in her garage and came back with the Simplicity. The difference was night and day. With the Craftsman, I was working harder than the machine. The simplicity was a walk in the park by comparison. Even the end of driveway deposit wasn't too much of a chore. More effort required by both machine and operator but it got done. I did three long and wide driveways that morning. One right after the other. The Simplicity was still eager to go but I couldn't say the same for myself. The bottom line is that the higher end machines earn their premium price when the going gets very difficult. Any machine can toss six inches of powder. Thirty inches of heavy wet snow will severely tax lesser machines as well as their operators.

borat ... I love reading real experience posts like yours. Thank you.

With the high talk of the Simplicity, I guess this thread has come full circle to my original question on whether to be concerned with the new electric chutes on the Simplicitys. :)

Since I started this thread, I thought I should add something I found out today regarding electric chute controls. I was looking at another snow blower today. I'll spare you the details as they aren't real important. But what I wanted to mention is that I asked the owner/dealer of the store his thoughts on electric chute controls. He told me that MTD used to have them on some of their snow blowers a few years ago. He said there were a lot of problems with them when moisture would get inside the wiring and then freeze up. He stopped carrying them and suggested I stay away from them. I don't know how "normal" his experience is ... it's just what he told me.

That kind of bums me out because I really liked the Simplicity 1428. But if the electric chutes really are that much of a problem, I'll turn my attention to Ariens or Toro.

Any thoughts on this? Thanks.

You have to remember that MTD makes value level snow blowers.  That means that their electric chute rotation probably was a cheaper/weaker design.  Also factor the length of time MTD had this feature in the market place.  If it was their first attempt then that would explain a lot.  Simplicity/Briggs has been using electric chutes for quite a few years now and they have ironed out their problems.

Its like trying to compare MTD's quick stick chute design to the toro.  MTD makes a horrible quick stick.  Just because of this you can not generalize and say toro also makes a bad one.



Lastly a higher percentage of uneducated consumers own the popular brands... like MTD.  Not that there is anything wrong with owning one, but statistically more people will own a cheaper brand since there are so many of them in all the big box stores.  Uneducated consumers can be harder on their equipment, which would increase chances of failure.


In other words, don't worry.  Unless you are the type that will be bumed out about the purchase forever with the slightest hickup of the electric chute control.  (Remember that every brand has a small % of defects, just the nature of life.  In example, if you are the unfortunate one to get a problematic motor or something, just out of bad luck, would that tarnish your perception of the design?  Obviously the dealer will take care of it if something like this happened.  Or any problem for that matter.  These are questions to ask now to not be disappointed later on, after putting serious money down.)


BTW - I was in home depot today and looked at a Ariens Deluxe 30.  The engine was a B&S Snow Series.  NOT the Max version.  I don't know if the difference between the two matters.  On B&S website it seems the Max has the cast iron sleeve, but it doesn't state any other things.

Thanks opecrazy.

I would like to make it clear that I'm a novice when it comes to snow blower knowledge ... but learning. So please take what I'm saying here with a grain of salt ... especially if you're considering buying a Simplicity. I don't know anything about the design of the MTD electric chute (or the Simplicity chute). But I did want to pass along what was told to me, just in case there was anything to it. I'm glad there are people here that can explain the differences for people like me. Thanks again.

Snowgo - I think you'll be OK with the electric chute rotation.  When working, it should work better and faster than a hand crank.  OF course your concern is a valid one should it break (I have no experience with the electric units)  The Quick Stick on the Toro is a nice feature if speed and precision is your desire with chute angle/rotation.  The Toro, Simplicity, Snapper, and Ariens are all equivalent for the most part in quality and capability within a given size range.