Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

Here are the facts I can find:

 

Model	Toro	Craftsman
Price	$1,294	$1,190	(all taxes, extended warranties included)
Warranty	2 yrs	5 yrs	(both in-home / in-home pickup)
CR rated	# 1	# 4
Free wheel steering	Y	Y
Horsepower	8 hp	9 hp
Wheel Size	15 “	16 “

 

Everything else (clearing path, etc) seem equal.  Normally I would jump on the Toro, based on its superior rating, not only for this model, but for many of their other models that have consistently done well in CR ratings.  The only caveat is, in a big storm (15” or more) does anyone think the extra 1 hp of the Craftsman will make a difference.  Two people I work with have Ariens (hard to believe I don’t disclose everything about my life in one post so this fact might shock some people).  One loves his 8.5hp Ariens and says it is more than adequate even in 15” storms, the other disagreed and traded in the 8.5 hp Ariens for an 11hp Ariens.  The “end of the driveway” was the argument for the latter co-worker getting a bigger machine.  Both co-workers say their wives could not use their Ariens due to handling is difficult (especially getting it out and in the garage where the pavement is dry).  So for me, the Ariens is not a product I want to consider.

 

I’m curious as to your opinions specifically about the hp between the Toro and the Craftsman.  Is it necessary to get a bigger machine (I live in upstate NY, but not in Syracuse or Buffalo – near Albany, where we get about 60” year in total snowfall). 

SnowRemover wrote:

The difference is quite literally nothing. They are the SAME Tecumseh engine. It is all marketing and stickers.

For example: The engine in question has a dyno rating of say 8.4 horsepower. So, Toro looks at it and says "let's call it 8 hp". Ariens says " close to 8.5 so that is what we will call it". Sears looks at it and says " well it is more than 8 hp and we know that horsepower sells so lets order the 9.0 hp stickers." Same engine. Different perspectives. Bottom line....... look at the other features NOT the horsepower rating of similar machines.

Ken
:)

I just called a local dealer who says he has two Toro 828LXE's in stock.  He assembles them as soon as he gets them to make sure they work and will drop the price to $1,250 (with tax it jumps past $1,340 - but the $50 is worth it to buy local).

That said, is there anything I should look at to make absolutely SURE it is not a used product.

Thanks!

This isn't completely reliable but look at the skid plates and other moving parts for paint chips. If he's a Toro dealer and it's this years model the chances of getting a used one are very slim. If it's been moved and tested chances are the skid plates will have a little paint scraped anyway. The rest should be pristine. Also give it the sniff test to see if it has that new snowblower smell.

You're going to love it!

Jerry

SnowRemover wrote

There are 2 basic ways of measuring horsepower.  At the crankshaft or flywheel and on the ground. I dont think one hp would present a noticible difference except possibly in conditions that max out a machine. even then with all the factors involved  there could be no noticable difference.  Weight of a machine, type of drive (belt, chain or gears) tire or track size. its entirely feasible that a higher horsepower machine would actually have less usable horsepower to propel the machine and power attachments.

a good example of this is some years ago i had 2 tractors rated at the same pto horsepower (a case and an allis chalmers) it would be a very long post if i went into specifics about each, but pulling identical tools behind them the case would work 10 to 15% more ground in the same time period using approximately the same amount of fuel. presumably the reason for this was more usable horsepower on the ground, therefore more horsepower available to work.

it would be interesting to take say 10 identical engines (10 hp briggs for instance) and dyno all of them to see how close to actual hp raitings they all were.i woudlnt be at all surprised if there was as much as 10% difference between all of them.

  SP,

         I totaly agree with you, it is Hp at the wheels that counts!!

                                                            Fred

When I read it earlier the freewheel steering fields were stars.

I can't give you the cold hard facts you seem to want. The only thing I can offer is a personal anecdote.

I own the track drive version of the Craftsman (888500) you are considering. I would not buy another one, or under most curcumstances, recommend it or one similar.
The machine is fine on our typicall snows but struggles more and more as the snow gets wetter and wetter to the point of operating better as a plow than a snowblower. I have owned and used other machines and for the most part the premium brands mentioned are far superior in difficut conditions. It is only my opinion, take it or leave it.

Hi Snowremover,

Wow, I just read you are now considering a Toro 828 LXE.  If you read my review on this board, your decision should be clear.  The 8hp engine is plenty powerful with very little vibration.  You'll be amazed at the throw distance you get from this machine.  This model does not require shearpins, so it's one less thing you have to worry about.  The auger gear case seems very large compared to other snowblowers I've seen.  It's no wonder Toro did away with the pins.  It was also apparent to me that Toro has gone in a great direction with this machine and the R&D shows.  If you want to save a few dollars, and  you don't want the freewheel trigger steering option, go for the 826 LE.  Do yourself a favor and have the dealer allow you to test each machine in his parking lot.  You don't need snow to run it around.  Good luck

I don't think 1hp difference would be noticable.  Either one would be fine.  Which one do you prefer?

Quote: That said, is there anything I should look at to make absolutely SURE it is not a used product.
Yes.
Check the engine model tag. (It's usually on the blower housing...near the bottom...on the left hand side of the engine.)
That tag is made from a heat sensitive material that changes colors when the engine has been run.
When it is fresh.....it has red letters with a gold background.
Once it has been started and heated....it will turn too black letters on a silver background.
Make sure that it is red and gold.....then you can be sure that the machine has never been used.
If it is silver and black....you know that they are trying too rip you off by selling you a used piece of equiptment.
HTH.

Lint,
Is there an unusual record of problems or concerns related to the 828lxe that you know of?
Is there a reason you mentioned they might stop making them?
If I recall correctly it was two band brakes, one on each wheel to lock the wheels to the drive? Seemed pretty simple, but with something new, there usually seems to be an issue or two.
They already stopped the Power Shift, if they keep stopping production they will be out of the blower business.
Thanks.