Vacuum Cleaners Discussions |
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M00seUK
Joined: Aug 18, 2007
Points: 295
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #84 Jan 19, 2010 4:54 pm |
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Cameron,
I do what I want, and I often back it up too. Thank you.
What is it about the ease of pressing 1 of 4 flooring type selection-switches on the DC28 do you find difficulty with or difficulty understanding? I say joe-public or the masses CAN easily get their head around these selection choices and take advantage of these technologies. By comparison, I say joe-public or the masses CANNOT get their heads around and/or forgo selecting the ‘all to important’ manual height adjustment (for whatever reasons). The DC28 selection switching is very user-friendly and the Dyson floating head is 100% user full-proof.
Dyson Invents Big
James Dyson said that he preferred the floating head method to manual height adjustment, as he believed the vast majority of people didn't bother with the convoluted method bending down to slide across a lever for each floor type. This was certainly true to my personal experience, back in the day, wondering what this lever was for on the family vacuum, since it never seemed to be used for anything. If people don't use it in practice, it's next to useless and little more than a 'me too' selling gimmick. If you *are* going to have such a feature, the approach of having an effective implementation and easy to use controls sounds reasonable. Personally, I want a vac to do a *good* job and I'm not sure if I should worry about deep down cleaning. But for getting good cleaning scores that matter to a percentage of the buying public, it'll be interesting to see if Dyson's approach pays off - anybody here have any idea on how well it scores as yet??
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Severus
If my vacuum can remove even one spec of dirt that yours misses, then mine is better than yours - even if there's no proof that mine would have picked up as much dirt as yours...
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 397
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #85 Jan 19, 2010 5:14 pm |
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Cameron, I do what I want, and I often back it up too. Thank you. What is it about the ease of pressing 1 of 4 flooring type selection-switches on the DC28 do you find difficulty with or difficulty understanding? I say joe-public or the masses CAN easily get their head around these selection choices and take advantage of these technologies. By comparison, I say joe-public or the masses CANNOT get their heads around and/or forgo selecting the ‘all to important’ manual height adjustment (for whatever reasons). The DC28 selection switching is very user-friendly and the Dyson floating head is 100% user full-proof. Dyson Invents Big  Dustmite, Just for fun, how does Dyson advise you to pick the height setting? Do they provide working definitions for short, deep, and medium pile carpeting? As for the ideal system of adjustment, I would think that Sebo/Windsor is close to the ideal with it's automatic height adjustment.
The smart tyrant writes his own story to ensure that it is favorable. The lazy will repeat lines from the book without fact checking.
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retardturtle1
Joined: May 16, 2009
Points: 358
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #86 Jan 19, 2010 5:21 pm |
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Venson,
The floating head always trumps a head requiring manual height adjustment when the majority of folks simply do not adjust or adjust properly. CR can adjust a head properly, but it cannot get it’s head around the fact that the majority of its paying subscribers cannot or will not. CR delivers a crap product in this regard.
The DC28 does work but feels heavy. A lighter version maybe?
I’m not buying the Venson - bad guy, Severus - good guy Dyson role-play. I find it freaky.
Dyson Invents Big
DIB
I gotta say ,excellent point on the floating head....as i personally prefer the floating head over the manual setting. Never really seen where one cleans better than the other ... turtle1
This message was modified Jan 19, 2010 by retardturtle1
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retardturtle1
Joined: May 16, 2009
Points: 358
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #87 Jan 19, 2010 6:18 pm |
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Dib-ster: The bagless fad's legacy in the USA, not sure about elsewhere, will be handhelds, sticks, robots, central vacuum systems and perhaps some applications for commercial vacuums/cleaning services. WRT full size household vacuums, canisters and uprights, bagless will be primarily the venue for less expensive, non-repairable and use/dispose brands and models sold primarily through big box stores. Bagged vacuums have been and will continue as the vacuum of choice for the majority of American consumers, households, motels, hotels, hospitals, restaurants and all other applications. Dyson made an ignoble attempt, through slick pitches and claims, to conquer and destroy the bagged vacuum industry as we know it. He tried to make it exclusively bagless. [Why is the question]. He failed. It didn't work. It won't work for all the reasons already detailed here. You should be content in knowing that the legacy of your fave innovator Sir James is this: A high priced bagless vacuum with a niche market in the USA. Sir James will have to work very hard in the future, just like all the other vacuum makers have, to attract and keep customers buying his brand/models. That's dyson's number one goal and mission now. [Not warring against bagged vacuums]. By him reducing vacuum operations from 31 plus global markets to only 6 [US, CAN, AUSTRALIA, AUSTRIA, JAPAN, and UK] in 2010, Sir James and dyson are making a realistic start. Carmine D.
HI CARMINE
Ive yet to see any bagless upright stand up to commercial use.....they come in D.O.A..... ..never returning to work. Bagged is the way to go...ive also noticed that those who once ordered sanitaires w/ shake out bags...hate them and order the bag set up.....the majority of our vac sales are to previous bagless owners...who went bagged then bagless then back to bagged.....within a year or two. Full bag out......new bag in and your done. But i will say that bagless cans do seem to hold up very well....only come in for annual/bi-annual full service.....pretty solid machines from what ive seen.
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #88 Jan 19, 2010 6:35 pm |
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...or we could turn that argument around and say that some folks here persistently said that Dyson should improve in that area... as soon as they're seen to improve, they're still beating the drum, because they didn't once upon a time...
Hello M00seUK:
Dib-ster is trying to have it both ways. So is Sir James. And you too with the above argument. You want to say that Sir James had it right with the floating head and no adjustments for the reasons he stated: People don't use the adjustments properly anyway. Then, after the defunct clutches and floating heads proved problematic on many USA carpets, Sir James got it right by adding adjustments that require manual setting, save the automatic default to medium when you power up. Perhaps, Sir James is trying for run as a Parliament Member, and practicing being all things to all people. Dyson is by no means the first brand to have fingertip controls for rug height adjustments. The HOOVER Z had them before dyson and so did the EUREKA lux Intensity. These two models have been maligned either by Sir James/dyson fans. The Intensity via a formal grievance with the ASA by Sir James. The HOOVER Z by dyson admirers who impugn its lackluster sales at big box stores. Yet both were good enough to be copied by dyson at least WRT the the fingertip control rug height adjustments. Then too dyson copied the floating head from HOOVER's Dial-A-Matic................from 1963. That's innovative? Quick, get me a dictionary so I can see if the definition changed and no-one told me. Carmine D.
This message was modified Jan 19, 2010 by CarmineD
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DysonInventsBig
Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #90 Jan 19, 2010 11:39 pm |
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DIB I gotta say ,excellent point on the floating head....as i personally prefer the floating head over the manual setting. Never really seen where one cleans better than the other ... turtle1 Thank you. I believe going with a floating head was a genius business-move. Dyson Invents Big
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DysonInventsBig
Location: USA
Joined: Jul 31, 2007
Points: 1454
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #91 Jan 20, 2010 12:13 am |
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Dustmite,
Just for fun, how does Dyson advise you to pick the height setting? Do they provide working definitions for short, deep, and medium pile carpeting?
As for the ideal system of adjustment, I would think that Sebo/Windsor is close to the ideal with it's automatic height adjustment. Jughead, From the Dyson DC28 manual... For the best cleaning performance Dyson recommends the following cleaner settings:Setting Carpet/floor type Deep pile - Plush, multi-styles and shag Medium pile - Level-loops and lighter plush Short pile - Commercial grade carpets and Wilton styles Bare floor - Delicate rugs/carpets, floorboards, tiling, laminates, vinyl, etc.
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #92 Jan 20, 2010 6:44 am |
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True.
Dib-ster:
I didn't realize it was a true or false test. I thought the answer was multiple choice and "all of the above." Carmine D.
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: bagless kirby conversion
Reply #93 Jan 20, 2010 6:53 am |
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Jughead,
From the Dyson DC28 manual...
For the best cleaning performance Dyson recommends the following cleaner settings:
Setting Carpet/floor type
Deep pile - Plush, multi-styles and shag
Medium pile - Level-loops and lighter plush
Short pile - Commercial grade carpets and Wilton styles
Bare floor - Delicate rugs/carpets, floorboards, tiling, laminates, vinyl, etc.
Dib-ster:
You know what? When the sales person at BEST BUY demo'ed the DC28 to me this past June, she left it on the medium setting after she powered on. I dumped the dirt and debris from a display DC14 bin on the low pile rug and asked her to vacuum it up. She left the rug height setting on medium. She passed over the area one time back and forth and didn't get it all up. I stopped her in the process. I hit the low setting and I made one pass and picked up everything that was left. She saw the result. She said to me I don't like the low setting because it's too hard to push and pull. So I leave it on the medium setting. Gee, that sounds familiar. Let's see. First, people don't read User manuals. Second, they don't set proper rug height adjustments. Third, why bother with them? Give them a floating head and tell them one size fits all. Bingo. I mean EUREKA! The answer. Now, true or false? Carmine D.
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