Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

The Achilles heel in every vacuum since the dawn of electricity has been the dirt removal/filtration dichotomy. Increase one, decrase the other, with a few notable exceptions-water filtration machines (with a separator and an electric power head) the Airway and Electrolux multi-layer bags, and now the 3M filtrete bags. No, they are not perfect, but they are a vast improvement over any other cloth/paper filtration system. More dust trapped with higher airflow over a longer period of time, that is the goal.

Dyson and Rainbow (Hyla-et al) are beating a dead horse. They keep comparing their filtration systems to the most popular, (not always the best) competition AT THE TIME OF THEIR INVENTION.

Over sixty years ago Electrolux and Airway figured out that multiple-layer bags gave better cleaning and filtration over longer periods of time, and  3M filtrete is the next logical step in the advancement of that technology. Older cloth bag vacuums leaked, but in light of the quality of air with coal burning factories, tanneries, meat packing and rendering plants, the vacuum was a quantuum jump in cleanliness. But today, bagless hepa is an oxymoron, like 'military intelligence'. If you need the standard of hepa filtration to avoid going to the ER with an asthma attack, what are you doing with wall2wall carpet in your home anyway? The person who is thus afflicted should not be vacuuming, EXCEPT with a central vac, or a Miele canister, or something like a Rainbow. Alas, Airway is no longer with us.

Once the filtration is determined to be satisfactory, issues of nozzle design, user friendliness, type and quantity of soil to be removed all come into play. Filtration is one of the primary considerations, but, if a vacuum cannot pick up the dirt, it cannot filter it. A 100.00 bagged Big Box vac with proper and frequent enough use and maintenance will do a respectable job of removing a buildup of dirt and keeping it at bay. Every vacuum needs maintenance. A 100.00 Dirt Devil and a 2000.00 Kirby both need bag and belt changes and the roller brushes cleaned to perform at optimum efficiency. This is how and why the purchaser of an expensive vacuum (name your brand) can be sold another of the same, or a different, brand just a few years later: infrequent use, improper use, and neglect of the three B's (bag,belt,brush). Allergy symptoms will be drastically reduced with any vacuum provided the buildup of dirt in the home is removed and kept from accumulating. Less dirt = reduced symptoms. I have seen the customer's vacuum emerge victorious, not often, but often enough to prove the point that frequent use, proper use, and appropriate maintenance are more important that the brand of vacuum one owns, cheap big box bagless units notwithstanding.

One true story supporting Trebor's filter comments;

Years ago I owned a Hoover Flair, which was a $50 stick vac with decent suction, surprisingly good brush roller, and an abysmal thin cloth filter cone dirt collector that would choke on dust after 30 seconds of use on my rugs.
After adding a shroud of Miele Filtrette-style bag over the cone, the same vacuum could go 5 minutes on exactly the same rug and dust without choking itself off.

The added, thicker dust collection media enhanced dirt collection, and made an otherwise unusable vacuum work well.

As for the merits of bag .vs. bagless, I'll leave that for others to discuss.

Same applies bag and bagless: Filtration.  Bagless vacuum filters clog despite what one maker claimed.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:

Fact that one makers filters do not take as long to clog as the bags.  And they perform better clogged thatn the bagged do when cloged.

HARDSELL wrote:

HS, another ID10 T dyson comment.  Why?  The fact that constantly escapes you dyson fans is that most retailer bagged uprights filled with dirt usually outclean and groom rugs better than a bagless dyson, choose your model, with brand new filters.  Every single industry source says so.  Of course with your dyson color glasses, you can't see it.  At least you don't use a dyson anymore.  What more proof do you/we need?  Your actions speak louder than your ID 10 T comments, which are deliberately stupid.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:
Carmine;

Stop w/the "hidden" words.  I am sure people are tired of this "One-Upping" they are reading in the posts, from this forum.  Eventhough this post is addressed to Carmine, I want everyone to follow it.  There is this back and forth conversation going on that is so tiring.  If the topic is about filtration, discuss it.  Continuing to  make someone look ignorant does not help the flow of the forum.

Mike W.
Moderator

"...Over sixty years ago Electrolux and Airway figured out that multiple-layer bags gave better cleaning and filtration over longer periods of time, and 3M filtrete is the next logical step in the advancement of that technology..."

Really? I thought it all had to do with cost. Because back in the 1970s when multi fitration bags were largely unheard of, brands decided to use the high filter bags to make extra money. This is certainly apparent in the UK with Electrolux bringing out Miele type fabric disposable bags that cost twice as much as their standard 2 layer filtration paper bags.

A 100.00 bagged big box (as you put it) vacuum will keep in dirt IF it has proper sealing textures and that points to hoses, pipes, tools and everything that the dirt goes up before it reaches the bags. Even having a high filter bag system and an additional pre filter built in doesn't neccessarily promise 100% filtration.

Mike W.

If you mean your advce to be for everyone, then why did you address to me only. I can't help if one poster here asks ID 10 T questions and makes ID 10 T comments and does not get warned about being deliberately stupid.

Carmine D.

Mike W.

I tried to send you a private message with the above but apparently it didn't go thru.  Not sure why.  So I posted it here above for all to see and read.  Just like you did to me.  BTW ID10 T stands for idiot.  Now it's not hidden word anymore.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:

I made a comment with no inuendos.  You didn't.

HS:

It ws an ID10 T comment, which now has no innuendo.  I gave you the benefit of the doubt by saying your comments are deliberately stupid.  Else the alternative is true.

Carmine D.