Vacuum Cleaners Discussions

Cute, but hardly original.  EUREKA [Electrolux Home Care] has been using "Pet" for some time in association with its vacuums.  In fact, EUREKA has an entire vacuum line so named: Pet.  EUREKA uses the caricatures of pets on the dirt bins for these models and also real pets [cat and dog] on the Web Site.  Here's the site FYI:

http://www.eureka.com/index.php?option=com_needstates&view=needstates&from=mainmenu&task=getproductsbyneedstate&needstateid=6

Carmine D.

Dyson out-smarts, out-invents, gets-there-first, more often than his competitors.  Electrolux (vacuums) is asleep at the wheel in terms of inventiveness and creativity (the big stuff that matters) as are Dyson's many other competitors.  Dates settle who was where first and who is copying whom.  While Electrolux may of “been there first” with a single and unimaginative web page, Dyson committed more time, thought and money targeting the very large pet segment with a large web site.  As far as the retail experience and messaging goes...  Dyson led this segment from what I can determine.  And I believe Eureka is pathetically copying the purple Animal vacuums with their purple Pet vacuums.  Dyson put much more thought into his name...  Animal, which is a ambiguous name (cleans Animal messes and attacks messes like an Animal).  Pet is a weak name compared to being an Animal or attacking like an Animal or cleaning after the Animals... pets and children and rambunctious boys and husbands.

I can just imagine...  a big mess is made (pets, children, husbands, construction, filth, etc) and what sounds like the most powerful vac for a messy, dirty, job...  The Animal or The Pet Pal?  If the ancient Eureka/Electrolux were not slumbering they could of had the U.S. monopoly (Trademark) Animal long before Sir James.




Dyson trademarked the Animal almost 5 and 7 years before Eureka/Electrolux awoke from it’s slumber.

Dyson > Animal™ Filing Date, November 26, 2002
http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4006:3h2vrj.9.63

Eureka/Electrolux > Pet Fresh™ Filing Date, August 22, 2007
http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4006:3h2vrj.6.6

Eureka/Electrolux > Pet Pal™ Filing Date, January 15, 2009
http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4006:3h2vrj.7.18

Hello DIB:

Our 2 and 4 legged furry friends [aka pets] make us better human beings.  Animals live in jungles.

Carmine D.

Hi Carmine,

$700.00 or less is all it takes to purchase a trademark.  More proof these ancient manufactures are asleep at the wheel.  All good for Sir James and his employees, not good for the ancients, their employees and/or stockholders.

What’s more confusing?  Trademarked names/messaging below...
Dyson:  Animal™
or
Eureka:  Boss® 4D Pet Fresh™, Smartvac™ Pet Lover, Capture+™ Pet Lover,  Capture™ Pet Lover, Optima® Pet Lover, Pet Lover, Pet Pal™

I could not resist.   Eureka’s marketing suits... are they genius or goofs?


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

Hiya DIB:

You admit that your favorite brand's founder Sir James resorts to Pet  pictures in ads to pitch its vacuums,  he can't be a goof.  Can he?

Carmine D. 

General Electric 'resorted' to pitching their Model 111 upright at pet-owners back in 1933...

Hi Model2,

Can you share any old (mfg) pet ad picture[s].  It would be fun to see.  Thanks.        DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:
Hi DIB - here's the relevant section of the 1933 General Electric ad I mentioned above, the first one which sprang to mind. I'll check through the rest of my stuff and see what else I can come up with.

Hi Model2,

A very nice ad. Thanks.

I have not seen many like it until recent times. Back in the day, the individual vacuum manufacturer usually claimed, or left the consumer to believe, that its brand was a universal problem solver that could clean up anything. As well, vacuums basically started out as luxury items that many households could only afford one of. The best way to sell was to convince the buyer it could do everything except the dishes. I guess that's why Kirby, Filter Queen, Electrolux came up with so many attachment options.

Venson

Model2,

I like it!  Thank you very much.         DIB

The GE pictured, based on the tube handle, was a good performer on rugs and on pet hair.  Metal roller with wide tufts of horse hair. 

Carmine D.

Glad you guys like the ad - I love the Model 111, I shipped mine over from Australia. It's a beautiful example of Art Deco influence on appliance design (styled by Allmon Fordyce of New York). It also has several innovative, patented features which distinguish it from its contemporaries. A lot of thought went into the design.

No wonder "pet" made the cut rather than 'animal."  A real designer engineered the GE vacuum, not a wanna be!

Carmine D.

I received a Dyson Animal Canada email blast today, these Dyson blasts are looking more and more like Apple’s...  clean and concise.  Click here

DIB

The "d" brand may get your personal kudos for its graphics when it comes to the "animal" moniker BUT..........for actual performance the December 2009 Consumer Reports recommends the HOOVER WindTunnel bag and bagless Anniverary upright models for households with pets/animals AS WELL AS all other rug and bare floor cleaning.  The EUREKA upright pet series product line does well for pet/animal cleaning and overall rug cleaning but falls short on bare floor performance, leaving it off the CR list of recommended.

Carmine D.

For those with 4 legged family furry friends, you are probably familiar with Dr's. Foster and Smith, veterinarians, who have an extensive pet healthcare products line for over 26 years.  They typically sell their pet supplies and products through a web site and home delivery catalogues.  I noticed just recently that the good doctors have added a vacuum brand for its pet [dog/cat] owners: BISSELL, which also gets an honorable mention from Consumer Reports in December 2009 for pet hair removal.  Here are the BISSELL products from the web site for those interested.  The unshown product, which can be viewed by clicking on the view all icon, is the BISSELL SpotBot, a favorite of mine and a popular seller among most big box retail stores.

Carmine D.

Dogs Showing 4 of 5 products Bissell® Pet Hair Eraser® Upright Vacuum As low as $169.99 Bissell® ShedAway Pet Grooming Vacuum Attachment As low as $24.99 Bissell® Pet Hair Eraser® Corded Hand Vacuum As low as $39.99 Pet Hair Magnet As low as $11.99 Cats Showing 4 of 5 products Bissell® Pet Hair Eraser® Upright Vacuum As low as $169.99 Bissell® Pet Hair Eraser Corded Hand Vacuum As low as $39.99 Pet Hair Removers As low as $9.99 Cat Trackmat As low as $14.99

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DysonInventsBig wrote:

I read the copy... Stiff Bristle FORCED into the carpet....whoa BOY! Sounds like a disaster for carpet wear in the making. INNOVATIVE!

DysonInventsBig wrote:

I read the copy... Stiff Bristle FORCED into the carpet....whoa BOY! Sounds like a disaster for carpet wear in the making. INNOVATIVE! Should fool another whole bunch of saps... I mean consumers.

DysonInventsBig wrote: Lucky1 wrote:
5 out of 5 stars is what Dyson DC28 owners are reporting/reviewing on BestBuy.com.  Of course that could all change when the vac-whacks post phony reviews - after reading this and following this post date. 


DIB

Lucky1 wrote:

Hello DiB:

The Best.Buy.com reviews are impressive in terms of the star ratings.  Almost all 25 reviews give dyson's DC28 a 5 star rating.  Having used a display DC28 at Best Buy in June 2009, I was impressed by its rug's performance vice all other dyson uprights to date.  But, it is the most expensive of all dyson's to date at $599.  And, if adjusted even correctly, especially on medium to high pile carpet, I noted dyson's DC28 is hard to push/pull.  This is same critical comment made by Consumer Reports for its DC28 review. 

So, I gleaned the 25 BestBuy.com reviews quickly.  In defense of Lucky1's comment, I noted that a substantial number of these 25 reviews make note of DC28's heavy weight, difficulty to push, lack of maneuverability, need for personal muscles to use, and/or physical work out routine despite the 5 star ratings granted by these reviewers.  These comments are directly related to and/or a direct result of Lucky1's observation/conclusion: "Stiff bristle forced into the carpet ...sounds like a disaster for carpet wear in the making. 

Friction in pushing/pulling a 21 pound vacuum over the rug in time leads to pile/rug wear.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:

Hello DiB:

The Best.Buy.com reviews are impressive in terms of the star ratings.  Almost all 25 reviews give dyson's DC28 a 5 star rating.  Having used a display DC28 at Best Buy in June 2009, I was impressed by its rug's performance vice all other dyson uprights to date.  But, it is the most expensive of all dyson's to date at $599.  And, if adjusted even correctly, especially on medium to high pile carpet, I noted dyson's DC28 is hard to push/pull.  This is same critical comment made by Consumer Reports for its DC28 review. 

So, I gleaned the 25 BestBuy.com reviews quickly.  In defense of Lucky1's comment, I noted that a substantial number of these 25 reviews make note of DC28's heavy weight, difficulty to push, lack of maneuverability, need for personal muscles to use, and/or physical work out routine despite the 5 star ratings granted by these reviewers.  These comments are directly related to and/or a direct result of Lucky1's observation/conclusion: "Stiff bristle forced into the carpet ...sounds like a disaster for carpet wear in the making. 

Friction in pushing/pulling a 21 pound vacuum over the rug in time leads to pile/rug wear.

Carmine D.

Thats all a potential customer has to read, heavy. hard to push,hard to use,Another big money dyson product that of to never ,never land, I;m not dissing metalica.

mole wrote:

Hello MOLE:

Always best to read the actual reviews and not just look at the star ratings.  In fact, I noted at least one of the above reviewers, despite giving dyson's DC28 a 5 star rating, knocked it for its plasticity. 

Carmine D.

DIB,

  As there are more reviews the number will go down.If you looked at the rest of the 5 Star reviews you would see Electrolux Versatility. One reviewer said they couldn't wait to get rid of their Dyson because of their problems with it. Another reviewer had a salesman that owned a Dyson and said the customer could bring her cleaner back for a Dyson but she  liked the Versatility.

  When you get  more reviews than what you have we will see if the 5 stars stays. The stars were not based on ease of use, which is one of the key things I ask a customer when they talk about buying a cleaner. They say best Vac ever but don't always say what they had before. There are many brands out there that get the same remarks when new but what will it be like in 6 months,a year?

                                                                                                                                                                                Procare

CarmineD wrote:
Did they 'knock it' because the use of plastic caused them a problem, or because they *thought* it might cause a problem?

M00seUK wrote:

The user's comments, as I recall, implied that a price tag of $600 warrants better product construction than the dyson plasticity which he/she said is usually reserved for less expensive vacuums.  MOLE's comment on "metal made" sparked this user's comment and inspired me to post it.   Else I would not have mentioned.  As I recall too, the user granted a 5 star rating to dyson's DC28.

Severus recently posted that he liked the Royal Powercast upright despite its weight, if I recall almost 27 pounds, because of it's metal made construction.  He said it's the price you pay for superior performance.  I recall making the same comment to my dear Wife several years ago in our home when she complained about the Royal Powercast weight.   She too liked the performance but she just couldn't get passed the weight issue.  I took it back and it was then she tried/tested an ORECK and fell in love with it.

Carmine D. 

procare wrote:

Hello Procare:

I agree.  There is an initial 'honeymoon" period for new products and users, even if they criticize, will grant generous ratings with weeks of buying/using.  After a period, usually 6-9 months to a year, the reality sets in.  Star Ratings come more in line with real life.

Carmine D.

Whoo Hoo an INTERNET REVIEW! Slightly more reliable than a Teenager on Prom Night...You won't get pregnant, just "Trust Me"

Lucky1 wrote:
These 25 customer reviews represent about $12,000-$13,000 of product.  New technologies that work...sell.   

DysonInventsBig wrote:

But, the real question for you/dyson is:  Will they sell enough to keep the dyson ball rolling....no pun intended...time will tell. 

I'm pleased you used the total retail value of $12,000 to $13,000 for these 25 sales and not $15,000.  The MSRP of dyson's Airmuscle DC28 was $599.... but within just a few weeks of its launch was advertised and sold for $500 by BEST BUY stores........and still. 

Carmine D.

procare wrote:
Procare,

I’m sure you’d agree 5 out of 5 is a good start.  And certainly better than reviewers claiming Dyson’s new technology as junk; as do the resident vacuum bag huggers.

DIB

DIB,

  You refer to the technology as new. new it is not . It is an old technology put to the vacuum cleaner .That is the reason it states ROOT's cyclone. Roots Blower came up with the technology before the turn of the century. It is just an innovation.

                                                Procare

DysonInventsBig wrote:

As well as rug height adjustments, like LOW, MEDIUM, and HIGH, tho brand new for dyson and DC28 Airmuscle uprights, have been a staple of the vacuum industry for almost as long as vacuums have been.

Carmine D.

DysonInventsBig wrote: procare wrote: CarmineD wrote:

Carmine,

I know not knowing your topic sells inside vac shops.  On here, when you dumb down patentable technologies or new technologies it's conning - or is it that you cannot get your head around the vacuum's technologies?  The Dyson pile height adjustment is done by raising and lowering the brushbar within the nozzle cavity and in concert to the nozzle being [Air] muscled into the carpeting. 

I say this DC28’s new technologies are candidates for a lighter next generation lightweight.  In concept, the vac works as advertised, only it feels heavy.  The DC15 proved the Ball concept and ultimately sold huge via lighter versions.  I’d expect lighter version/s of the Airmuscle to do the same.


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

Hello DiB:

Technique trumps technology every time!

Carmine D.

DysonInventsBig wrote:

You just don't get it. the MARKETING is making the sales not your blind fetish for technology. I don't know your relationship with the company but it's pretty typical of the Dyson people I have dealt with. It's all about INITIAL SALES. You don't care/have respect for the Retailer, The Warrantee and worst of all the Customer. These are merely an inconvenience for your company. While I appreciate your blind loyalty I also wince at how selfish and simplistic it is.

Lucky1 wrote:
Lucky1,

I may be unaware, but I think you have yet to post your wares by brand, model/s, bag costs, cost to keep suction at 100%, and by price.  I think a more-level playing field makes for more fun, don't you?


DIB

Lucky1 wrote:

More accurately, not maybe, but you are unaware. 

I know the vacuum brands Lucky1 sells by his posts here.  It just takes reading and keeping up with Lucky1's posts, which you most likely haven't done. 

I don't ask the prices of these vacuum products because I know that as nationally recognized vacuum store brands these prices are pretty much standard for the industry within a specified hi-lo range.  I also know personally and professionally that vacuum consumers who buy from independent vacuum cleaner stores do not make their purchase decisions solely on price.  I'd say with 100 percent assurance that price is not the most important factor.  It is customer service: which is priceless.

Carmine D.

CarmineD wrote:

More accurately, not maybe, but you are unaware. 

I know the vacuum brands Lucky1 sells by his posts here.  It just takes reading and keeping up with Lucky1's posts, which you most likely haven't done. 

I don't ask the prices of these vacuum products because I know that as nationally recognized vacuum store brands these prices are pretty much standard for the industry within a specified hi-lo range.  I also know personally and professionally that vacuum consumers who buy from independent vacuum cleaner stores do not make their purchase decisions solely on price.  I'd say with 100 percent assurance that price is not the most important factor.  It is customer service: which is priceless.

Carmine D.

  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----

I’m asking for 5-10 minutes of Lucky’s and Mole’s time.

Please...
1)  Brand names/models/prices of the 5 top sellers, w/ manufacturer suggested annual belt/belt service and bag replacement costs?
2)  Brand names/models of top 3 highest priced vacuums, w/ manufacturer suggested annual belt/belt service and bag replacement costs?
3)  What does it cost in annual bag replacements to maintain 100% suction strength?
4)  Where is the money going?...Why do these [basic-in-function] vacuums have such high price tags?  Is the money going towards advertising, towards R&D, towards testing, towards patent protection, towards launching/supporting new innovations?


DIB

DIB,

The expense, or lack thereof, in annual operating costs is of small consequence if the user finds their vacuum unpleasant and clumsy to use and maintain.  A bagless vacuum
for someone with allergies, who must empty the container him/her self is ludicrous.  There is no easy way to completely avoid contact with the dust, even with emptying in a closed
trash bag.  The container still needs to be washed and dried.  How much easier and faster to simply close the seal on a hepa bag and toss it, and quickly install a replacement!

The real test of Dyson's staying power in the marketplace is whether he can keep his market share. 8,000 cleaners/day in US alone in this economy ain't too shabby.  But the comparison
of operating costs is only valid if the customer who is contemplating the purchase deems it so.  The cost of bags/ filters against the cost of the machine is not the correct one. One does not calculate the cost of oil changes against he cost of the automobile, but as an investment to prevent premature replacement.  The cost of bags, etc, are more accurately compared to the cost of carpet replacement, as a clean carpet will last longer as we all know.  The cost of bags is insignificant to one who has breathing difficulties triggered by contact with the dust. So the comparison you asked for is of no import save to the purchaser of the vacuum cleaner. 

We are approaching the point where bagged vacuums will be an oddity to younger people, like phonograph records. I stopped in to see my vac shop friend today, and witnessed a customer refer to her bagless vacuum as a "canister" vacuum. She was totally unaware that vacuums other than uprights had ver been invented.  She was only aware of bagged vacuums at all, because her first one was given to her by a relative who had purchased, as she called it a "canister" vacuum. (Dirt Devil).   She concluded that after having a "canister" vacuum that she wanted to buy a vacuum that used bags, and she was willing to pay a premium price (she chose a Miele S7 at 599.00 on sale.) She was happy  to learn that bagged vacuums were still being made and after her experience with a bagless vacuum she wanted to buy something effective, quiet, easy to use, hepa filtration, and of long lasting quality, and that used bags. The cost of a 5 pkg of bags and a hepa filter/yr was of no concern to her given the increased health and convenience of the bagged system.

Regardless of what our beliefs and preferences are here on the forum, what matters is the customer getting what they want and need, at a price they are willing to pay. Period.

DysonInventsBig wrote:

As I posted above WRT your questions to Lucky1, the same applies to MOLE.  If you keep up with his posts here, you'd know the brands and you'd know, if you have a basic knowledge of the industry, the hi-lo price ranges of these models.

The point which obviously escapes you is that the products and their prices are not the primary business of the vacuum cleaner store owners and operators.  These change over time.  Especially over the many years that MOLE and Lucky 1 have been in the vacuum business.

The key characteristic which promotes their businesses, keeps their customers coming back year after year, and grows their businesses over time is not the products they sell and their prices.  It's customer service. 

To quote myself again:  Technique [customer service] trumps technology [products/prices] everytime.

Carmine D.

Lucky and mole go after Dyson and those who buy Dyson religiously and vigorously.  Turnabout is fair play, I’d like a chance to pull their commodity-crap vacuums apart, their punitive-prices apart and their hype apart.

You’re in the way Carmine.


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----  ----

I’m asking for 5-10 minutes of Lucky’s and Mole’s time.

Please...
1)  Brand names/models/prices of the 5 top sellers, w/ manufacturer suggested annual belt/belt service and bag replacement costs?
2)  Brand names/models of top 3 highest priced vacuums, w/ manufacturer suggested annual belt/belt service and bag replacement costs?
3)  What does it cost in annual bag replacements to maintain 100% suction strength?
4)  Where is the money going?...Why do these [basic-in-function] vacuums have such high price tags?  Is the money going towards advertising, towards R&D, towards testing, towards patent protection, towards launching/supporting new innovations?


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

I am in the right way of thinking and unfortunately, you're not.  The answers to your questions, which you should know and not have to ask if you paid attention here, are irrelevant.  I've made the point several times to you.  Trebor too.  As well as Lucky1.  Yet, you still don't get it.  It's customer service [I forego adding the operative adjective] for Lucky1 and MOLE that makes their vacuum businesses successful.  Not the products and prices which are incidental.  

Carmine D.

DysonInventsBig wrote: Lucky1 wrote:
Lucky,
When you go after Dyson owners - most would consider this going over the top.  When I know there are hard working people and elderly people purchasing and loving their Dyson's and you calling them saps...  well, it triggered something in me.  Now, I'm not interested in your scope or point of view of how the industry should or should not run or how James Dyson should or should not run his business.  I am interested in giving your wares and price points and [lack of] technologies a working-over as you freely and unashamedly do here with Dyson (and yes, I am baiting you).


DIB

DysonInventsBig wrote:

The wares [your word] are not the key in the vacuum cleaner store business.  The vacuum and floorcare products that Lucky1, MOLE and all the other successful indies sell are dependent on their business locations and clientele.  The overriding business characteristic that they all have in common is providing excellent customer satisfaction [aka customer service].  This BTW is Trebor's point in his post too.  They have to stand behind their new/rebuilt products, all repairs, and parts sales with personal and professional integrity.  Else, they could not be/stay in business.  Do you know/have any instances of Lucky1 and MOLE not doing this?  If so, you can work them over.  If not, you really have nothing to say against their business practices and products.

Carmine D. 

DIB and Lucky1,

Gentlemen,

With respect to both of you, neither of you has truly addressed the issue of the DC28 brush roller.  Stiff, as in whose definition? Remember the original Dyson brush rollers, (the smooth
metal rods with the long soft bristles, followed by the small spiral plastic ones, again with widely spaced soft bristles) ? If those are the standard of comparison, then the DC 28 may not damage carpet. On the other hand, if the bristles are as stiff as the Windtunnel's there could be a problem on some carpets. There have already been issues with regard to using some Dysons on some carpets, yet there has been consumer demand for better pet hair pickup or this new model would not have been created. It certainly is not for the European market that this was developed. So give Dyson some credit. He is at least paying some attention to the likes/dislikes of the purchasers of his products. 

DIB,

I am nonplussed by your description of customers who buy Dyson "religiously"?   A 400.00 plus vacuum should not need replacing often enough for a buyer to be called a "religious" purchaser, unless they are praying it will be better that the one they are replacing too soon? I have nothing against Dysons. For people who like them and don't think they are overpriced for what they get, they are a perfectly acceptable choice in a vacuum cleaner. Evidently 8,000 people a day in the US think so, enough to plunk down 400.00 plus, most of them without actually trying one out. As long as that pace continues, and most of them stay sold, and people buy another Dyson when they need a new vacuum, Dyson will have nothing to worry about.  If the pace falls off, or a large number are returned, or people stray from repeat purchases, that could put a crimp in Dyson's future. And it matters not one whit what any of us say, or our opinions about what each other says, the market will tell the story. Period.

Dyson's major venues are the 'net and BBR's, Dyson's choice from the get go.  If every vac shop on the continent refused to sell and/or service Dyson, or bad mouthed Dyson, it isn't really going to effect the outcome immediately because most people buy their vacuums off the net or at a BBR. Consumer satisfaction will ultimately determine Dyson's survival or demise. If Dyson chooses to consider the vac shop dealer as irrelevant to his success or failure in the marketplace, he has the right to test that assumption. If he drops his price point another 100.00-200.00 or so across the board, he may well be able to flourish alongside the likes of TTI and Bissell without regard or concern for the independent dealer/shop owner.  We shall all have to wait and see.

Trebor

Trebor wrote:

Hello Trebor:

In deference to Lucky1, the issue is not his to address.  It's dyson's responsibility.  Unfortunately, as we all know, most vacuum consumers need to be shown the "ins" and "outs" of vacuum product.  In the case of dyson's DC28, demo-ers need to emphasize the importance of seting the proper rug height adjustment with different carpet styles and thicknesses.  Recall for over 7 years, until the dyson airmuscle technology, dyson users were told the dyson rug nozzle head was floating and self-adjusting.  As tho this was a new technology for the industry rather than a failed concept from more than 4 decades ago that HOOVER had to deal with on the Dials.  Now, dyson has to get DC28 users to be conscious of proper rug height adjustments.  Hard to do when your primary buying clientele are big box retail shoppers who don't read user manuals.

Carmine D.

Carmine,

When did Oreck start offering height adjustment? Oh yes, when they introduced the HALO. Are you saying for more than 40 years Oreck has been peddling a failed concept?

Hmm,

Trebor

Trebor wrote:

Hello Trebor:

HOOVER Dials and Powers are full size all metal based heavy vacuums.  The Dials struggled on mid-high level carpets with their high powered suction and no rug adjustments.  Hence HOOVER added the adjustments and then transmissions.

ORECK on the other hand at less than 8 pounds fares well on most all rugs low to high.  However, note from my posts here that I give the HOOVER lightweight bagged Platinum better grades for higher carpets than ORECK and ORECK better grades for lower.  As I pointed out, no vacuum is perfect for all scenarios.

Carmine D.

Carmine,

The biggest problem with the Dial-a-Matic Hoovers was the too narrow hose into the housing.

The Panasonics, Riccars, and Simplictys do well without a height adjustment. What made the Hoover dials problematic?

Trebor

Trebor wrote:

Hi Trebor:

Biggest problem[s] for the Dials:  I can think of a few:  The "floating head" in concert with full suction on med-high rugs; the handle breakage at the top of the bag compartment housing; the smallish plastic motor mount under the vacuum that breaks from hard pushing/pulling on rugs; the electrical plug connection in the handle that comes undone; the small dust bag, to name a few.  Not a perfect vacuum despite it's technologicl advance of 2 vacuums in 1: upright and tools.

Panasonics, RICCARS, and SIMPLICITY uprights, all post HOOVER Dial, don't use a "floating head nozzle" [reused by dyson in DC07 and 14 models] that drops down into the medium and high pile carpets.  Making them hard to push and pull.  Like I said, a failed concept from 4 decades ago quickly corrected by HOOVER with rug height adjustments and automatic transmissions.. 

Carmine D.