Vacuum Cleaners Discussions |
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #36 Apr 26, 2008 7:35 am |
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Hi Carmine. You too H.S., I am going to let it out of the bag,the only thing the customer cares about is the price, if it breaks under warranty and they will the only redeeming factor is that the local dealer will handle the issues,you and i both know that dyson and hoover and some others have the shop owners trapped because of the contractual agreements,the big box stores make the sales and then use us as patsies for warranty work. I would say that most indys put competitive products on the back burner,after dealing with most EURO companies they could care less about their dealer network other than the ocaisional walk through by the regional manager which usually costs us lunch and coffee. The talk is the usual chit chat about the other stores the hardware stores that sell 5 to your 1 of products,these guys really make you feel good and then try and give you expert advice about how to run your business[business plans] which more than likely work only in favor for them not you,
Though the experience gained over the years i take these people with a grain of salt, not all i dislike but most.
The best line ever is i said to a few of these manufactures reps, If you think your so smart how come your still working[and broke] , He did not take to kindly to that and left and quit.
Carmine, I cannot sell dyson and tell my customers that we are doing them a favor,the machine is absolutely not worth the money,and most LEGIT dealers tell the customers please dont buy it from me,i really dont need the headaches down the road,it's also nice to see the customer come back later down the road and says i should have listened to you,
MOLE
Mole: I agree. With everything. I would not sell particular vacuum brands too. Did okay for 40 plus years.
Carmine D.
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HARDSELL
Joined: Aug 22, 2007
Points: 1293
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #37 Apr 26, 2008 7:49 am |
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Hi Carmine. You too H.S., I am going to let it out of the bag,the only thing the customer cares about is the price, if it breaks under warranty and they will the only redeeming factor is that the local dealer will handle the issues,you and i both know that dyson and hoover and some others have the shop owners trapped because of the contractual agreements,the big box stores make the sales and then use us as patsies for warranty work. I would say that most indys put competitive products on the back burner,after dealing with most EURO companies they could care less about their dealer network other than the ocaisional walk through by the regional manager which usually costs us lunch and coffee. The talk is the usual chit chat about the other stores the hardware stores that sell 5 to your 1 of products,these guys really make you feel good and then try and give you expert advice about how to run your business[business plans] which more than likely work only in favor for them not you,
Though the experience gained over the years i take these people with a grain of salt, not all i dislike but most.
The best line ever is i said to a few of these manufactures reps, If you think your so smart how come your still working[and broke] , He did not take to kindly to that and left and quit.
Carmine, I cannot sell dyson and tell my customers that we are doing them a favor,the machine is absolutely not worth the money,and most LEGIT dealers tell the customers please dont buy it from me,i really dont need the headaches down the road,it's also nice to see the customer come back later down the road and says i should have listened to you,
MOLE
Mole,
Why do so many buy Dyson if all they care about is price. It is one of the most expensive. Why would anyone buy a $700 electric broom (Oreck)?
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #38 Apr 26, 2008 8:39 am |
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Mole, Why do so many buy Dyson if all they care about is price. It is one of the most expensive. Why would anyone buy a $700 electric broom (Oreck)?
I can't answer the first authoritatively but a famous line from BT Barnum comes to mind.
The last is an easy one, HS. Even I know the answer to it. Because it [Oreck electric broom that cleans and grooms equal to a full sized upright] comes with a 21 year guaranty and free maintenance every year for life. How many brooms do you still own and use after 21 years? Think about how many one purchases in a lifetime. What is the total cost? Do they come with free maintenance for life and a 21 year guaranty? At the turn of the 20th century, carpet sweepers were sold by comparing them to the cost of brooms. A broom cost 25-50 cents. A carpet sweeper usually from $1-$4 depending on the type of wood used. Carpet sweepers according to the claims lasted indefinitely. As opposed to brooms that wore out. Carmine D.
This message was modified Apr 26, 2008 by CarmineD
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mole
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Location: earth
Joined: Sep 30, 2007
Points: 783
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #39 Apr 26, 2008 9:24 am |
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Hi H.S.,Oreck is an upright just like dysons dc18, Orecks have price ranges from 200.00 up,unlike dyson whos 300 plus, Carmine is correct the oreck cleans as well as any other upright out there.Also have a 40 + year reputation behind them,Also it's made in the U.S.A. one of the few left,but thats another story for later on. If the customer really needs and upright for their application and are shopping oreck against dyson most places that sell both will sell the oreck,and keep the jobs in this country,B.T.W. central vacuum systems cost less than a DYSON or oreck.................... mole |
CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #40 Apr 27, 2008 7:19 am |
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Hi H.S., If the customer really needs an upright for their application and are shopping oreck against dyson most places that sell both will sell the oreck,and keep the jobs in this country, mole
Mole:
Sorry folks to get off subject. And perhaps it's not off subject. But is the subject. Mole's observation about the vacuum industry, especially independents, is honest. The indy dealers [thousands nationwide] sell Oreck-s in large part because they are USA made and have 45 plus years of history and sales success. Big box retailers sell the foreign competition. The Oreck is and always has been a top tier contender lasting a lifetime. The big box retailers sell disposables. Getting back to dyson: Perhaps the reason dyson loses market share every year in it's own country of origin, the UK, is because the UK consumers disapprove of James Dyson's decision to out source jobs to foreign contractors in Malaysia. Maybe they believe it is a socially irresponsible business decision. Predicated on profit motives. Maybe that's the reason for Mr. Dyson promoting an Engineering school in the UK. A way to give back to the UK [and try to gain back market share from the UK consumers who now shun dyson products]. Something to ponder? Carmine D.
This message was modified Apr 27, 2008 by CarmineD
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #43 Jun 25, 2008 1:21 pm |
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DIB: I'll make the same observation [not theory] about the dysons from Bestvacuum.com as bestbuys.com. ALL the dysons, including the latest and greatest DC24 and 25, are discounted from MSRP. Many substantially. Except one: The least: DC16 still $149. There is even a disclaimer excluding the DC16 for discounts from MSRP. Did you see it? Interesting? Absurd? Laughable? All the above? I'll go with all the above. iMacDaddy nailed it right. Dyson is scrubbing the DC16. Gave up on improving the run time. Two different sites on two different days and same observation to make. All dysons are discounted from MSRP but one. Why? It's the worse of the dysons. But the DC16 is listed at $149. The original and full MSRP. Why? Try this for an answer. Dyson USA is discounting the DC16 by $100 with the sale of any new dyson. Put the word out to retailers not to discount the DC16. How long will it be until the few retailers stuck with these do the same as dyson. Or better? They have to do something to compete with dyson and get rid of these. They are not going to increase in run time based on increased time sitting on the shelves. The longer these lay unsold, the more difficult they are to sell. Especially with the run time specified and the star ratings of the users. Unless dyson agreed with the retailers to take all these back for credit? Like the DC11. Carmine D.
This message was modified Jun 25, 2008 by CarmineD
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dusty
Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Points: 264
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #44 Jun 25, 2008 10:48 pm |
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DIB: I'll make the same observation [not theory] about the dysons from Bestvacuum.com as bestbuys.com. ALL the dysons, including the latest and greatest DC24 and 25, are discounted from MSRP. Many substantially.
All dysons are discounted from MSRP but one. Why? It's the worse of the dysons. But the DC16 is listed at $149. The original and full MSRP. I will make the same observation regarding any brand that is sold thru box stores, not just Dyson. A look at Amazon.com finds every Hoover they carry deeply discounted off the MSRP. Same applies to Bissell. If your argument is that they don't command the same pricing at Dyson then check www.allergybegone.com and find all the Electrolux product discounted to death. As far as the DC16 not being reduced at those two websites, that is indeed true but a little searching finds Best Buy and many other retailers discounting the product. If deep discounts sounded the death bell for a brand of vacuums we'd all be using brooms and dustpans to clean with. Dusty
This message was modified Jun 25, 2008 by dusty
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CarmineD
Joined: Dec 31, 2007
Points: 5894
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Re: Dyson DC23
Reply #45 Jun 26, 2008 7:12 am |
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I will make the same observation regarding any brand that is sold thru box stores, not just Dyson. A look at Amazon.com finds every Hoover they carry deeply discounted off the MSRP. Same applies to Bissell. If your argument is that they don't command the same pricing at Dyson then check www.allergybegone.com and find all the Electrolux product discounted to death. As far as the DC16 not being reduced at those two websites, that is indeed true but a little searching finds Best Buy and many other retailers discounting the product. If deep discounts sounded the death bell for a brand of vacuums we'd all be using brooms and dustpans to clean with.
Dusty
Thank you Dusty for using observation and not theory. Here's the crux of the matter. All the dyson dealers in the past here bragged of dyson's MAP and price supports for product MSRP. You too. MOLE and I said it wouldn't last. All you need do is check the past vacuum history for big box retailers. In the big box venue, these retailers would force dyson to drop prices and like it. Or else. You and all the dyson fans argued that it would never happen with dyson. NEVER. Maybe on the old discontinued models [MAYBE] but not the new dyson stuff. WRONG. Discounts on everything dyson, new and old. Except the DC16 which will probably get scrubbed by dyson in the USA after they are all given away.
Dyson fans flip flop now and put dyson in the same category as all the big box vacuums. Hello! Thank you! Flip flop, flip flop when will it stop? You're late to the right side of the debate. MOLE and I told you this years ago. Didn't listen. Rookies! Carmine D.
This message was modified Jun 26, 2008 by CarmineD
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