Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I've repainted my blower housing, impeller, auger and chute (pictures to come) and replaced the impeller bearing and got the engine purring like a kitten.  I've got the whole thing back together...almost, when I notice that there is some play in the axle where it penetrates the tractor housing.  I was going to address the tractor in the off-season but with no snow in the foreseeable future and backup equipment available just in case, I'm thinking of replacing the bearings and any related h/w.

My problem is twofold.  How to disassemble the drive axle and how to identify what needs replacing.  I can't tell if the wear is in the housing or the washer that fills the opening or the bearing or the bearing retainer or all of the above.  When I put the blower on the housing and remove the bottom plate, I wiggle the axle and see some movement in the space between the housing and the washer and possibly between the axle and the bearing.

Looks like I'm going to have to disassemble it to know for sure.  Anyone who has been down this road, feel free to share your experiences.

The parts I was looking to replace, according to the parts manual:

(2)  05417700 Bearing-Ball 1.45 x 2.19 x 0.63
(2)  06417000 Washer-Flat-Steel 1.140 x 1.718 x 0.134

Here's the starboard side:


Here's the port side but the bearing area is not visible:

Been down that road many times.  The movement in the axle is usually caused by two things.  The bearing itself wears out and in addition sometimes the axle shaft itself gets worn
inside the inner bearing race.  You won't know whether you have one or both problems until you pull the axle.
The good news is that the teeth look good on both the diff and the sprocket pinion gear.  Sometimes when the axle slop gets really bad on the left side and isn't corrected
for a long period of time.  The gear mesh gets sloppy as well and the teeth get worn down badly.

Before you attempt to pull the axle.  I've found that it is easier to clean the rust off the axle while it's place.  You need to take all the rust off and clean up the shaft real well
(bare steel) so the bearing on the right side can slide off.  Sand paper usually works as well as anything.  Unless you have 3M Scotchbrite discs for a Die grinder or drill.

First, pull both wheels.  Then drive out the drift pin that goes through the axle.  You can clearly see it on the right side in the photo.
On the left side drive out the pin or remove the bolt holding the locking hub on the axle.  Remove the hub then pull off the short axle. 
Back to the right side.  Remove the four nuts holding the bearing holder to the frame.
Now you should be able to side the axle out the right side of the housing.  But you will also have to hold onto and support the diff. as the axle sides out of it.
Pay attention to the washers on the left side as the axle comes out.  Especially the ones between the diff. and the housing.
After you have the axle out remove the bearing holder on the left side. 
Check to see if the inner bearing race is snug on the axle or if it has play on the shaft.  Hopefully they're both snug and the axle itself isn't worn.

Just as a side note.  Make sure you clean the rust off of the rod above the axle in the photo.  And apply a light coat of stiff grease.  That aluminum fork slides on that shaft.
Over all things look pretty clean and good in there.

In addition to what was already posted, I'll add a link to instructions with pictures.  I found this helpful when I took mine apart.  It isn't exactly the same as yours, but close enough.

http://www.abbysguide.com/ope/discussions/32526-0-1.html

manjestic, I just did that to my "new" ST824 (looks just like yours, with the high-mounted control panel), so I'm happy to help where I can. My machine had very worn wheel bearings. But, as jrtrebor mentioned, the inside of my bearings, and the outside of the axle shafts, were also worn. New bearings did a lot to reduce the slop & play. But it's still not perfect, the bearing is loose on the shaft currently. What I want to do is have the axles welded up where the bearings mount, then machine them back down to size. Barring that, you could try something like JB Weld on the area, then file it back down until it was about the right size, so the bearing can slip over it. Loctite also makes products for taking up gaps between a shaft and bearing. But using that would make the bearings difficult to remove in the future, without using heat. This all assumes that you have some axle wear, and that it's significant enough that you want to try and address it. Hopefully you *don't* have any wear on the axle.

I had enough wear on my axles & bearings that my gears don't look as nice as yours. My smaller spur gear's teeth are quite rounded. But the new axle bearings appear to have eliminated the occasional skipping that I was getting between the gear teeth.

If it were me, I would drive out the axle roll pins, and try sliding the axles out through the bearings, before spending a lot of time trying to get the rust off the axles while they're installed. If the inside of the bearings have worn larger, then they may slip right over the rust. If not, then you can worry about cleaning the rust up while the axles are still in the machine. But maybe they'll come right out.

I did not have to remove the 4 bolts for the bearing mounts when removing my axles. They do need to come off to remove the bearings, but that can be done later. Note, however, that mine were rusted up, and the nuts would not simply come off. The bolts have little splines that are supposed to keep them from spinning in the frame. Unfortuantely, several of mine started to spin, so I had to cut the nuts off. I replaced them with stainless hardware. But I would start putting some penetrating oil on the 4 bearing mount bolts on each side, to hopefully make them easier to remove.

As jrtrebor said, make sure that everything that slides is greased. I also put a thin film of grease all along the length of the axles themselves, to help keep them from rusting up again. I also greased the teeth on the differential and mating gear. My chains also have much more lube on them than yours do (previous owner used some sort of heavy oil, it seems). Check that the tension on the two chains is correct as well, while you're in there. I also replaced the bearing on the port side (for the intermediate chain shaft), the small bearing with the grease fitting on the outside. That was worn for me as well.

I'm jealous of the condition yours is in Mine appears to have led a harder life. All my paint is in rough shape, more things are worn, etc. You did a beautiful job painting the housing!

manjestic wrote:

This is curious and must be a typo (1.45).  Ariens Parts Radar does show the dimensions for the bearings as being 1.45 x 2.19 x 0.63.
But the axles are 1 1/8" (1.12) OD.  The ID of the axle washer is 1.14 and any searches for the bearing (05417700) sold by different parts places
show the bearing ID as being 1.129 .  

jrtrebor wrote:
I referenced the Ariens Parts Manual (part no. 024046E dated 7-95).  I verified that the typo was not my doing.  Good catch.

Thanks for all the advice and wisdom.  I'm sure we'll get a blizzard as soon as I snap off the first rusty nut clear.

Dismounted the axles two nights ago...snow's coming.  I think those two events are cause-effect.

manjestic wrote:
Please continue to take it apart, I heard there might be some snow heading for us too.

I agree, continue to dismantle that snowblower.  A big storm is coming this way.  Nobody buy another snowblower!

Good thing I have backup machines.  I'm storing my brother-in-law's 6.5hp Craftsman and I have a Toro CCR 1000.  My neighbor comes by occasionally with his Bobcat with a poly blade, too. 

I was wondering why you were so brave to open up the snowblower in January.  Yeah, I got a back up snowblower too, and that one has its back up.  :)

Ordered new axle bearings.  I now am checking other wear items in the reduction gear drive.  New concern...when I disassembled the differential, I didn't notice parts 36 or 39 as shown below.  I'm wondering if they are missing or perhaps I have the wrong parts manual.  Anyone?  Bueller?

36 and 39 and pressed into the small axle hub.  They have to be hammered out.  They are bronze bushings.

When I opened mine, I noticed 39 (the little one). I think it stayed on the small end of shaft 32. I did not notice 36. I looked later, and it was still stuck down inside the hollow part of shaft 38, buried in grease. Despite how it appears in the picture, bushing 36 slips inside of 38 (it's between the outside of 32, and the inside of 38).

When you manually slip the two shafts together, even if not in the machine, they should kind of be snug together, if the bushings are present. The bushings keep them aligned (parallel) and concentric. If the bushings are not present, the two shafts will probably be able to tilt and move around relative to each other.

Those bushings look as if they are part of the axle.  Even with the axle perfectly clean a person wouldn't know they were in there.  As long as the short axle doesn't have any side to side
 play when it's on the axle.  The bushings are fine.

Thanks, I do see them now.  There is no play when the two axles are put together, so no need to replace the bushings.  On another note, the differential assembly, 43 in the diagram...how does that get lubricated internally?  Or is it sealed?  I imagine that the pumping grease via the grease fitting on the short axle feeds grease along, up to the splined end and perhaps to the internal gears of the differential assembly.

I need to check for play with bushings 34 and 22.  Bearing 14 looks good on my machine.

manjestic wrote:
The diff. is fairly well sealed on the outside.  And once the axles are in place there really isn't much of a chance of dirt or water getting in through the center hole.  I would assume they are lubed at the factory
and that is that.   It's usually the teeth that get worn that causes problems.  There may be some grease that works it's way in from using the short axle grease fitting.  But that fitting is primarily to keep the inner and outer axle lubed.  After everything is back together.  I usually take a stiff bristle brush and dab stiff grease into the diff teeth all the way around.  Not a whole lot, just enough to put a coating on all the teeth after you've spun it a few
revolutions.
Of the two pairs of bushings.  You really want to make sure that they 34s are good.  They really wear because of the load that is on them.
If they are worn you will know after you clean it up and slide it on the shaft.  Sometimes the flange will wear off the end of the bushing as well.  You didn't appear to have a lot of dirty grease build up in the housing so the flanges are probably ok.  I believe that is what causes them to wear.  Dirty grease is like valve grinding compound.  As long as your in there, if they aren't nice and snug I would replace them.
The 22 bushings don't wear as quickly.  But are worth checking.

Any advice on how to take up any slack in the bearing retainer?  That is, the axle bearing holder does not appear to hold the bearing tightly and keep it from moving within the space it occupies.  I was considering something tacky like an adhesive or perhaps wrapping tape around the perimeter.

Measure outside diameter of your old bearing and measure the new.Say for example the difference is .030" then,you would use shim stock of .015" which will bring it to the same outside diameter.You want it tight in the retainer so that only the center of bearing spins.Good luck,Allan

You really just need something to keep the outside of the bearing snug. Like hirschallan said, shim stock would work, but the around-the-house version might be aluminum flashing or tin foil. Put a strip or two between the outside of the bearing, and the inside of the retainer, and get the bearing in there. You could maybe tap the outside edges of the bearing into the retainer with a small mallet or something. It doesn't need to be in there for all eternity, just nice and snug so it won't spin.

I did put a film of grease on the inside of my (rusted) retainers and on the outside of the bearings, since the originals had rusted up quite a bit. I had to knock one bearing out of the retainer with a hammer and a vise.

Are you sure you have the right bearings?  Almost all of the Ariens axle bearings have a concave shape to the outer bearing surface.  It's not flat like most other bearings.
If your new bearing have the flat surface they will not work with the Ariens bearing cups.  Although you could try and shim them.

jrtrebor, I bought the Ariens axle bearing part number in my IPL from Jack's Small Engines. My bearings had a "flat" outside diameter, if I'm correctly interpreting what you mean. The outside diameter appeared to be a constant size (2.190", I guess, from the description in manjestic's first post). If they were in fact convex/concave (so that the diameter was, say, 2.160" at the outer edges, and 2.190" in the center), then it was subtle and I don't recall noticing it. From manjestic's pictures, his unit is identical to mine (924082), as best I can tell.

Not trying to dispute that many/most may have a shape to their OD. But I don't recall mine seeming like that. I still have the old bearings, but they're so rusted up it might be difficult to check conclusively. If my new ones actually had a profile to the OD, and I simply didn't notice, my apologies.

Thanks for all the replies; there will be a little something extra in your paychecks this month. 

I haven't received my new bearings yet, but that's another story.  So, I can't measure the difference.  I put the originals in and secured the retainer to see if there was any wear in the retainer.  The bearing (outer race, if that is the right term) did move vertically maybe a millimeter within the retainer.

A picture would be best here, but the original bearing is flat enough that it will stand on end.  That is, the there is no concave- or convex-ness to it.  Though the edges are radiused.

Just thought I would throw that out there about the concave bearings. 
My Ariens 924084 1032 has the concave bearings.  But I picked up a JD 1032D for parts a while back.  It tractor unit is identical to my Ariens but it has regular bearings for
the axles (non concave).  So after this season I'm going to swap out the bearing holders and put in new bearings.  Standard bearings are cheaper than the concave ones.

You can buy a roll of self stick aluminum tape at any hardware store and wrap the bearing as was suggested.  I have used it before on an axle worn down by the bearing.  Just put a couple of wraps on the
axle to snug up the bearing.  Not a permanent fix but will work for a while. 

I may have to use the old bearings for a while.  I just found out that my parts are back-ordered.