Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I'm considering updating from a 1993 Ariens ST824 to a newer machine.  Recently, I've been looking at a few Ariens Platinum and Pro models, a few of Simplicity's Large Frame and Pro models, the John Deere 1330SE, and the Toro 1128OXE, as well as used but recent models with a Tecumseh OHV engine or Briggs OHV.  Wheel and chute controls are an issue with a lot of people, so does anyone have experiences to share?

Differentials:

1)  Does anyone have experience with Ariens' "Automatic Traction Control or John Deere's 1330 SE differential ?  Does the Ariens know when to go to locked-wheel drive, or when to come out of it back to differential?  Will this design hold up after many years of usage?  Does the JD stay in differential mode, or does it have the locked-wheel option?  How do these blowers feel in operation?

2)  How does Simplicity's "Easy Turn" feature feel when turning left or right?  Don't you also have to stop the machine to go into and out of this mode ?

3)  Same questions about the Ariens Deluxe models with that left-hand trigger release feature.

Chutes:

1)  Then there are those new electric chute controls on the Simplicity Large Frame models and John Deere 1330SE.  Does anyone have any stories about these?

 2)  Toro has their "Quick Stick" feature, but how long can it last before the plastic parts break?

3)  Ariens' "Quick Turn" feature seems pretty nice, but I'm not sure about that cable release lasting long, and many guys have complained about having to constantly re-adjust it, or it flops around too much.  Also, the chute  deflector cable seems to freeze up a lot with some users.  Any comments here?

4)  Why can't Ariens just go back to a crank system that doesn't allow the chute to wander around at all?  Ariens, I hope you are listening.

 

coasteray wrote:

I'll answer the Toro questions

First off steer clear of the 1128OXE and get the cheaper 1028OXE it doesn't have the problematic scraper bar that the 1128 has. If you have a pristine flat driveway then the 1128 might be ok, if the scraper bar doesn't jam on you.

Toro has teh trigger steering and it couldn't be easier. If my wife who is 83 lbs. can operate a 250 lb. snowblower it's got to be pretty easy. We tried out the other brands and they were not as easy for her to use.

I've thrown rocks through my "plastic" chute and no problems. Most chutes line their metal chutes to prevent clogging. My plastic chute doesn't clog, not even in slushy EOD snow. This is my second year with it and it works as good as it did when I bought it. Plastic is not all the same. This isn't cheap plastic like they use for water bottles, it's hardcore stuff designed for years of throwing chunks of ice. The quick chute is a breeze to use and adjust.

You should try out all the models you are considering and see how easy/hard they are to turn, how well you like the chute controls. Plastic is better in the snow as it doesn't rust. 2 years and very happy with my 1028OXE, others have a lot more info on the other brands.

I had a brief encounter with the JD 1330SE when looking for a replacement for my JD 826.  It was a great looking machine, but just did not get the job done for me.  Problem was with traction getting into hard snow.  It just didn't.  The dealer came out and looked the situation over and agreed to take it back whereupon I opted for a Honda HS928 which works well for me.

The "snow hog" type tires on the JD 1330SE (and most other newer machines) were a problem.  They did not get traction when the going got tough.  My old JD 826 with chains on smoother tires way outperformed the 1330 here.  Chains are available but not recommended for the snow hog tires and some dealers even say they make things worse.  The Honda I ended up buying has tracks and these really improve things in difficult situations.  Takes some getting used to and a litle harder on the turns but OK once you develop the technique.

I did NOT like the easy steer system on the 1330.  It seemed to want to wander all over and took a great deal of effort to keep it straight.  This was especially difficult when taking a partial cut - the blower would  keep veering to  one side into the unblown snow.

I was a bit leary of the electric chute controls on both the Honda and the 1330, but they both seem to work well and don't get iced up and frozen.  Saves a lot of effort here.

This is my second winter with the Toro 826OE. My previous MTD had a chute crank with a manual height deflector (stop and adjust). The Quick Stick is possibly my favorite feature of the Toro. It makes lightning fast adjustments to throw direction and height. No crank or electric motor operates this fast. When the wind shifts and snow comes back at me, I can one-handedly aim the chute without stopping. With practice I can see the wind shift coming and re-aim pre-emptively. Parts of the Quick Stick shifter are heavy duty plastic and other parts are metal. The chute gearing is entirely metal under a plastic cover. Over 2 winters now, I'm at about 100 hours operation with zero problems. The Quick Stick has been completely reliable. 

I am also very pleased with the tight clearance and recirculation feature of the impeller housing matched with the non-stick, heavy-duty plastic chute.. Even in slush and EOD the unit has never jammed 

It does not have a steering system so I won't address that other than to say that power steering is pretty much required if a female is going to operate it.

coasteray wrote:

I purchased an Ariens 926 Pro this year that has the Traction control gearbox. I can honestly say after 3 bouts with Ol Man Winter the machine is very manuverable and  powerfull. I was somewhat apprehensive at first since my previous machine was a MTD track drive with trigger controls and it turned on a dime but after using this machine I am not dissapointed.  The quick turn chute is fast enough that I don't have to worry about blasting my car or the mailbox. I can't really comment on the other machines since I never owned or operated one but as far as I am concerned Ariens is a hands down winner.

Starwarrior

Admin,

   How can NJwarrier be posting?  I thought he was booted?    

He has multiple accounts. 

Thanks everyone for replying to my inquiries.  The comments about Toro, John Deere, and Ariens are definitely helpful.  I may find myself deciding between Ariens and Toro when it comes down to it.  I have to consider what the local dealers sell and service, as well, and definitely Ariens and Toro are easy ones there. 

coasteray wrote:

Happy to help, be sure to let us all know what snowblower you decide to go with. Post pics if possible.

aa35: He has multiple accounts. 

Obviously.  The comment is to the admin.  Why is he letting they guy have multiple accounts?

trouts2 wrote:

There's nothing in the terms of use that restrict having multiple accounts. As long as he doesn't violate the TOU, he can have as many as he wants, not a crime.

Wasn't he booted?

When we get a general or non-specific questions from new users, we should ask them for photos or pictures of their snowblower so we know they are for real or not.  beastiboy sounds too much like New_Yorker or DNJ.

trouts2 wrote:

You should ask the admin directly through pm. I'm sure they won't respond to such question publicly. See TOU.

Deleted double post

Steve_Cebu wrote:
Thanks, Steve.  I like that idea.  At this point, it will probably be next season.  I don't want to wait that long, but due to a new computer, external drive, and monitor coming up soon, I don't have much choice .  I saw your videos on You Tube, and I was very impressed with your Toro's performance.  I also like a few of the Ariens machines, so it's kind of tough to call right now.  One day I think Toro's 1028OXE would be great, the next day I think Ariens' Platinum 24 or 30, or Pro 26 would be great.  I must be confused .

coasteray,

what you are  feeling is very normal and will not get any better after the purchase either.  it is really is no different than buying any new hot toy.

coasteray wrote:

I know the feeling.   That said it's best to go out and actually try them at a dealership. Toro's quick chute takes some getting used to but once you've mastered it, it's great. The way and Ariens steers is very different from Toro's twin trigger steering. I had a Honda 928TAS that proved to be too much of a hassle and my wife couldn't use it at all. It also tended to wander left and right a lot. When you consider that tracks are a pain to move to begin with relative to pulling a lever, the Toro made more sense.

I think if you get to a dealer and Demo as many as you can while there is snow on the ground, you'll be able to make a better decision. Snowblowers steer very differently on dry bare tar than they do on snow and ice. Height of the handles is also a factor, some are short and in the videos with my wife you can see she has to reach up to the handles. They say it's worse if the handles are too short aka you are too tall. This isn't an issue for me, but for tall guys it could be.

You probably wouldn't buy a car without test driving it, neither should you buy a snowblower without testing it first. Most dealers have demo units (not sure about this late into winter) so try everything. Let the dealer steer you into testing as many brands as he sells and compare them. For me the Toro won out in every category. For you it might be Toro or Ariens or Simplicity etc... Heck it might even be a Honda!

I know what you are going through with a new PC. I've been trying to decide between a Sager 8150-S1 and a Sager 8170-S1 no question about most bang for the buck but 15.6" or 17.3" size is where I'm stuck, gotta order this week and that's about a $2k purchase.

I sold a 28 year old Ariens 824 and bought a 1024 simplicity pro. I love the power and how it works. It took a little getting used too but after the storms we have had here I am very with my purchase. Easy to turn and I love the power chute now that I am getting used to it.

Steve_Cebu wrote:
I'm wondering about Toro's extensive use of plastic for the 1028OXE as well as their other Power Max blowers with Quick Stick.  I've seen Toro's machines a number of times and always wonder about the long-term durability of the plastic dash and the associated plastic parts for the Quick Stick operation.  Then there are the plastic handles, and the plastic levers for the wheels and auger/impeller which of course have the cables extending down from them.  I honestly worry about the wires snapping off of those handles at some point.  Maybe my concerns are unfounded?  Perhaps the plastic used in all these areas is very durable.  It certainly won't rust.  The chute and housing plastic doesn't really bother me as it seems to be very durable in these areas.  Any thoughts? 

Actually, the Toro 1028OXE (I'd prefer the 1128OXE, but I don't like that  moving scraper bar idea) truly impresses me, but after my experiences with Ariens' steel build for so long (my 1993 ST824 , plus the ST1032 workhorses at my school job), I guess I naturally wonder about the plastic.  So far, no one seems to be complaining about Toro's plastic, and I haven't seen anyone mentioning problems so far.  But it's only been, what, about three years they've made these newer models?  Time is the only way to tell, I guess. 

Honda?  Well, it would be interesting to come across, say, a nice, used 928WAS wheeled model, but it would depend on the price.  One knock I have against Honda is that the wheels are permanently in a two-wheel locked setup.  I wish they would give us a lever to disengage the left wheel (like Simplicity, or Ariens Deluxe) for ease of turning and putting away the blower when done.

It's gonna be fun to see what I end up with, though. 

coasteray wrote:

The thing is many people worry about the plastic on the Toro's but you rarely hear of the plastic parts failing. You can be certain that if the plastic parts had even a moderate failure rate, it would be all over the Internet. Sure the cables do need to be adjusted every so often. That's just normal maintainance. This isn't el-cheapo plastic it holds up really well. I think people believe steel is better for everything. It certainly easier to sell people on the idea that steel is better because it's stronger. The thing is steel doesn't mix well with snow and ice compared to plastic. Although there is steel to support all the plastic pieces that Toro uses. Ariens and other companies know it's easy to sell people on steel. The thing is most people know nothing about steel, just taht's it's very strong and durable (not all steel is). I was a machinist for 15 years. I've worked with Steel, Aluminum and damn near every grade of both as well as many other materials including Copper (miserable stuff to machine) that was much tougher than your average steels. We also did a lot of work using materials that commonly get refered to as plastic. My father has over 50 years experience with materials and being a Master Tool & Die man knows his stuff. He can tell you what a material is from just looking at it. Some "plastics" are better for certain jobs than steel.

I'm not saying that steel machines are bad, just that it's easier to sell an all steel machine than one with any plastic due to the perception that plastic is cheap. Some plastics are pretty damn durable and expensive. The cast iron gear boxes are another easy sell. Dealers tell you how durable cast iron is. Well ok, but I've worked with Cast iron, we made products where we'd job out Cast Iron because we wanted cheap weight or bang for the buck pricing. Cast aluminum (probably a blend) is also cast. If my dad was up from FL I'd ask him what material they are casting the Toro gearbox with and how good it is. Casting is pretty common, look at a matchbox car, that's diecast. Casting is cheap, durable and if done correctly, well made. If done wrong or you get bubbles in the material it won't last.

Look at an Bridgeport Milling machine versus an Enco, the brunt of both machines is cast iron. Enco's are crap.

That said Ariens makes a good machine along with other brands. Honda is screwed together really well. I had one, but turning it is no fun as you say.

Once you get to a dealer and can test things out it's a lot easier to choose which is best for you. Ariens sells a LOT of machines every year, so they have to be doing something right. Toro also made in America sells a lot of machines also.

You know you got the right machine when you are happy to use it when the white stuff covers your driveway and you laugh at the plow as he pushes in another 18 inches of snowy, slushy, salty, grey and white crud at your EOD after you just finished clearing it.

I have no issues with plastic used on snow throwers.  In my twenty plus years of use with Craftsman machines I had no issues with the durability of the plastic chutes.  Keeping them on the machine was another thing.   I have no issues with steel chutes but I do have issues with them only being painted on the inside.  Fine for pure snow but not so good for eod deposits that contain gravel and salt.  To me, the best arrangement is a steel chute lined with plastic.  As with my modification and new Yamaha machines.  That way, you get the best of both worlds.

Heck, it's been 44 years since Dustin Hoffman was told that the future is "plastics" in The Graduate.

Plastic is often a superior material to metal in many applications: lighter weight, corrosion-free, naturally lubricated, tuned flexibility and can be equally as strong. In the steel vs plastic "quality perception"  department, I'm more inclined to go with the company using advanced plastics.

Toro's innovative impeller, housing, chute and controller in the very traditional snowthrower market (MTD for example), give me confidence that the plastic parts are well thought out also.

Last year I bought a Ariens Platinum 24, which I reviewed here and gave high marks to. I wrote that it's a great little machine with cool features like handwarmers, ATC for easy turning and a quick-rotating chute.

Now I have to point out one BIG flaw in the design-- the latching mechanism for the rotating chute is way too flimsy.  I was blowing snow a week or so ago, and the chute all of a sudden started to "free swivel" to the right under the force of the snow.  To keep the snow blowing left, I had to keep a hand continuously on the dashboard knob.

When I put the machine in the garage and removed the plastic cover of the latching mechanism, I could see that the little control arm (which engages with cogs that lock the chute into position) was made of flimsy bent metal.  The metal had distorted so that it didn't line up with the cogs.  By the way, I never (to my knowledge) abused the chute by forcing it against ice or anything.  My dealer gave me a replacement control arm and told me that this latching mechanism was a common problem for many customers.  Wish the sales guy had told me that!

Replacing the control arm was tricky and a big pain, since there's a tiny spring (shaped like a paper clip that you straighten and then wrap around a pencil) that has to be "pre-loaded" to apply tension to the control arm when it's engaged.  Getting this spring into position and keeping it there as I tightened the securing nut was very frustrating and difficult.

I called Ariens and spoke to a technical rep who told me that he had gotten feedback on this problem, but they hadn't devised a fix yet.  At the very least, they should cast this part so it can't distort, rather than use flimsy metal. Still, who knows what-- if anything-- Ariens will do?

I would advise buying the Deluxe version with the old-fashioned, but reliable, crank arm that turns the chute.  The Platinum's  traction control is nice, but the Deluxe 27 has a cable release on a wheel, which would make that model easy to turn, while avoiding the very finicky "quick rotating" chute that will no doubt continue to cause me problems.

amazer98,

    What it the factory model number of your machine?  I looked at the drawings for some 2010 chutes and can't see a latch in there.  Is the problem with the part in back of the chute or at the dash?   Can you post a picture? 

Amazer, I have the same set up on my Ariens.  It's an older deluxe model but a few years ago the deluxe came with the quick chute lever.  I've found that it's best to slightly lift up on the lever before moving it.  That ensures that it is fully unlocked prior to moving it.

Trouts, Unless Ariens changed it I believe that its the same set up that they used on model 926002

Is this the mechanism and where the problem is?  It looks like 10 turns the teeth on the top of 5 and 20 is the detent against the outer ring of teeth on 5.  Is 18 what has to be pre-wound?  It seems like 18 would just slip into 20, be captured by 21 and 6 run through 21 and be bolted on.  Is 20 stamped and should be the thing cast?

trouts2 wrote:
Hi Trouts,

Yes this is exactly the rig I have.  The culprit is the so-called control arm (#20).  The bottom of this arm (as depicted in the illustration) has to engage precisely with the cogs on the circumference of part #5.  It's a little hard to get a sense of this from the illustration, but when the control arm engages those cogs, it temporarily locks the chute into the position you want it to be at that moment.

Unless my control arm was distorted somewhat when it was installed in the factory(and therefore needed only a tiny bit more distortion to become ineffective), I found that just modest usage (perhaps 8-10 snowblowing sessions of one hour each) wore the control arm out so that I had to replace it.  When I removed my original control arm, the end that engaged the cogs was visibly splayed open (maybe just 1/16" or so... but enough so it wouldn't lock the chute).  The spring (part #18) was a $#%* to install, since one end has to press up against the inside of the bracket on top of the pole. You have to keep parts 6, 21, 20, and 19 aligned as you tighten nut #11... all the while with the spring loaded and pressed against the bracket.  If you back off the bracket momentarily, the spring snaps down and you have to try it again.  Not fun!

The spring is also too small-- it fits between the two flanges of the control arm with the protrusion of part #21 holding it in place... but it still has plenty of room to skew to one side, which is another frustration.

I could make a video of this, but that would mean taking the pieces apart first.  Can I simply video me smashing my thumb with a hammer?-- that would be less painful!

And... yes, #20 is the part I think should be cast.

I like my toro. Plastic is a non issue. If its strong enough for the beating that the ski's on a ski-doo take, its easily strong enough for the dash and chute of a snow blower. And it does have the benefits that it won't rust or clog.

Since Simplicity and John Deere  are both built by Briggs and Stratton, It boils down to which color you like best. The Toro uses a lot of plastic: good? bad?

So I believe the Ariens is your best choice, or a Husqvarna .

royster wrote:

The OP asked "Who's best?  Ariens, Simplicity, John Deere, Toro?"   Not Husqvarna! 

But I think I'll go ahead and recommend a Yamaha.    Its one of those brand, in addition to Husqvarna, that the OP can't get in the US.  So all is good!