Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

   SeaForm makes many claims about what it can do. 

 

Injector cleaner

Carburetor cleaner

Carbon cleaner,

Fuel stabilizer

Frees lifters – rings

De-icer anti-jell

Upper cylinder lub

Dries oil and fuel

Cleans carbon as you drive.

Cures hesitations ,stalls, pings, and rough idle due to carbon buildup.

Cleans dirty engine part internally by removing harmful gums, varnish and carbon.  WORKS AND PERFORMS INSTANTLY. 

 

   That’s quite a versatile list of claims.  Given the repeated claim for carbon it should do something when contacting carbon.

 

  SeaFoam says 1 pint treats 25 gallons.  That’s a mix of 200 to 1.  If it can clean at that mix it should dissolve carbon easily at full strength.  Below is a picture of carbon put in a class with full strength SeaFrom for several hours with occasional shaking.  There is no breakup of the particles. 

 

   The other picture of a head and piston with carbon.  The loose carbon was wiped off and the rags dipped with SeaFoam and rubbed on the head and piston.  The rags are slightly discolored but not from dissolved particles.  The discolor is just picked up particles of carbon a rag without SeaFoam will pick up. 

 

   Given that it did not dissolve carbon full strength and would not remove carbon with a rag directly on a piston and head it seems doubtful that at a mix or 200 to 1 it will do very much rushing over the head and piston of an engine. 

 

   SeaFoam does not seem to do anything. What went wrong here?  No dissolved carbon in the glass and only slight smudging on the rags with no removal of carbon from the head or piston after rubbing.  What’s going on?  If it does not do anything at full strength how can it work at 200 to 1 where only slight fraction of the 200 to 1 mix will actually contact the carbon when an engine is running

  What Friiy mentioned was interesting and made me thing about carbon “dissolving” as opposed to loosened somehow and being purged.  I snooped around the net, watched a few videos on Utube and read a bunch of claims.  There were suggestions there that the carbon is not dissolved by SeaFoam.  That the action was loosening the carbon binders so it would fly out.

 

   Given the testimonials, this morning I tried SeaFoam on a 7hp Tecumseh first dumping some Seafoam directly into the plug hole, giving several squirts in through throat until stumbling and white smoke dumping out of the muffler.  Then a big squirt to stall the engine and let it set for a while to let SeaFoam act.  I checked through the plug hole pretty good and noted the carbon inside on the piston and valves.  I noted the carbon at the base of the plug hole and changed plugs to fairly gummed up plug, sootie and blackened with carbon. 

   No noticeable effect after doing this test three times.

 

   I put some SeaFoam in a cup and Stable in another.  I added about 10 drops of water and let them set for a few hours shaking them occasionally.  When shook the water blob would dissolve into the solvents but in a short time form back up into a blob.  Possibly the stuff acts by vaporizing the water but after a few hours it seemed like the same amount of blob was in there.

   No noticeable effect.

 

   I called SeaFoam and asked to speak with a tech and got one.  I told him I was leery about the product and have seen many positive and negative comments on the net so did some tests and would like to go over them to see what he thought.

 

  He said both of the tests I did were valid, i.e.1.  the carbon in a container with  full strength SeaFram, without gas and 2. applying SeaFoam directly to the head and piston.  The 7hp test he said was also valid along with the water test.

 

   For applying SeaFoam directly to the head and piston test he said it SeaFoam will act without heat/combustion no gas needed to activate anything.  He explained what would happen.   It would work by breaking down the binders of the carbon which were “gum”, “varnish” and “other unburned products” which bind the carb to metal.  The quotes were his words.  It would act full strength without combustion or mixed with gas.

 

  He said, SeaFoam does not dissolve carbon, it breaks it down into minute particles so they can be blown away.   That is, the gums and varnish binders would be broken down.  That did not happened with applying SeaFoam directly to the piston and head.  A lot of SeaFram was applied and letting it set for a while to give it a chance to activate.  Nothing came off or on the rags which were also soaked with SeaFram.  No carbon removal, no breakdown of gum, varnish or burnt products as he said should happen.

 

   For the carbon flakes in a container with full strength SeaFoam he said it should reduce the carbon binders and cause them to break up clouding the liquid in the container.  That cloud would be the broken down binders and minute particles of carbon. That did not happen or anything close to that happen.  The amount of particles was the same as the start, no breakup or clouding.  SeaFoam did not do anything.

 

  I mentioned how I did not get the expected result.  He said he has done the same tests on pistons and carbon chunks in a container just like my tests.  He got completely different results.  He said the carbon on the piston came off and he ended up with a clean top on the piston.  He said the chunks of carbon in a container broke up and clouded the straight SeaFoam.  He said it worked fine.  That was not the result I got.

 

   His results were quite different than mine so I repeated the tests this morning with the same result I got last time and again much different that what he got. 

 

  For the running SeaFoam in the 7hp motor he said it should have had an effect.  I could not see any. 

   For the water in the cup of SeaFoam he said once the water blob was broken up it should stay broken up.  He said he did that test also and what he got was the water stayed broken in a cloud.  Very different result than what I got which was the blob reformed after a while.  It might useful for SeaFoam to break up water like that but a water blob in gas will cloud into the gas when shaken also. 

 

   Could have been a defective can of SeaFoam.  I tried the head and container chunk tests with two different cans of SeaFoam.  Could be a bad batch of SeaFoam so both cans have defective SeaFoam. 

 

   These tests are pretty simple so you can see for yourself what you get as a result.

So what was the SeaFoam rep's reason/excuse for the product not working for you? I'm certainly not challenging the results of your tests despite the fact that your tests were not as per instructions on the container. If the product is, as you say a totally ineffective snake oil, one would have to question why so many people, including myself, have had positive results using it. Your post has piqued my interest. I have a old Yamaha RD piston down in the basement with the rings locked up with carbon. I'll do a little experiment of my own and post results. I would like to post pictures but I no longer have the full "post options" menu available to me and can no longer access most posting features. However, I will provide an unbiased account of my results and try to post pics elsewhere and provide a link to them. Stay tuned.

x

Borat: There was no excuse given. I asked him what he though was the difference between our results and he did not give any reason. He just restated what his results were. We left it at a draw. He had his results and I had mine. For the test you can wet a rag with gas or water and get it blackened quickly removing the loose carbon. The problem part is after the loose flakey stuff is off and the tougher gums with imbedded carbon remain. That's the stuff SeaFram should disolve. That's the part where SeaFoam did not do anything for me and the rag only slightly smudges mostly from rubbing action rather than cleaning. One part I did not mention fully was on the 7hp through the plug and throat tests. He claimed that carbon should come off in chunks and fly out the exhaust. That should have been immediate so I should have noticed something looking at the plug and in through the plug hole. I had a blue tarp laid out away from the muffler to catch any carbon but did not see any. Try the cup of SeaFoam and water also. It jells back up into a blob on the bottom after shaking and clouding. I'm not so sure about that test but the rep said it should stay clouded up and he had done that test also. When I asked if he let it set and later looked back in he started talking about something else.

I put an old carboned up piston is a container with SeaFoam in it. I put it in at around 3 p.m. . So far, there is some accumulation black particulate in the dish. Assume that it's carbon. However, there is still a great deal of very well baked on carbon on the piston top that does not appear to be lifting or dissolving. Will let it soak overnight and advise results.

I put an old carboned up piston in a container with SeaFoam in it. I put it in at around 3 p.m. So far, there is some accumulation black particulate in the dish. Assume that it's carbon. However, there is still a great deal of very well baked on carbon on the piston top that does not appear to be lifting or dissolving. Will let it soak overnight and advise results.

mkd55: well lets see there is religion,political party ,war in iraq,illegal imigration,state,federal,and local property tax,global warming..........hmmmmm let's see...........have i missed anything else you want to share your opinion on  trout2...?

 

What's this all about mkd55.  There is nothing related to the post here other than a personal attack.  What's with the kid stuff you 59 you said?

trout2 !   it's my perception that you have a very strong negative opinion of seafoam and for whatever reason you have decided to bump heads with some of us that don't agree with you. you did not mearly explain any  bad experiences with this product that you have had but decided to comment in rebutal with other forums members opinions and experiences with seafoam.i am not going to speculate on  your education,mechanical background,or work experiences as to your validity of your own experiences  with this product, nor am i going to dispute any claims of your testing and results.you have choosen to not follow suit with your own comments.let's just leave it with i do not view your same perceptions on this subject and probably don't share your views on the topics i mention in my prior post either.

I have allowed the old two stroke engine piston sit in 1/4" of SeaFoam for a day and a half. It appears that the longer it sits, the better the results. Not that the piston is at all cleaned. However, by the looks of the residue in the container, it seems to have had some effect. When I put the piston in, the rings were pretty much locked into the grooves. The second ring with the expansion spring underneath it was totally seized. It seems that SeaFoam had sufficient effect to at least loosen up the baked in carbon to allow removal of the rings. My test is no more scientific than Trouts. However, my results seem to indicate that there is some redeeming value to using SeaFoam. Not sure it this picture will work. If not, cut and past into the internet address field. http://i18.servimg.com/u/f18/11/78/38/95/dscf3010.jpg

Mkd55: [you] decided to comment in rebutal with other forums members opinions and experiences with seafoam.

 

Nothing wrong with that.  I commented on what I though were some invalid assumptions and attributions related to posters use of SeaFoam. Posters expressed their comments about my tests and conclusions.  Nothing wrong with that. 

 

Mkd55: and probably don't share your views on the topics i mention in my prior post either.

Your unrelated off topic personal comments are out of place on any forum. 

 

Borat: I have allowed the old two stroke engine piston sit in 1/4" of SeaFoam for a day and a half. It appears that the longer it sits, the better the results.

 

Do you think soaking in soapy water for a couple of days would have done the same?  Do you think the lub action could have played a part in the rings like WD-40?  SeaFoam seems to be a very thin oil.  The SeaFoam rep said the action should be immediate and the product claim is the same. 

 

Borat: Not that the piston is at all cleaned.

 

   From the photo it does not seem to have done anything.

   If that piston in the picture soaked for all that time and that is the result I would say SeaFoam was pretty useless.  The rep did a similar test and said his piston came to bare metal without scraping just cleaning.

 

   Given what you said you were going to do and anticipating you would get different results than mine I dipped my piston head in SeaFram for a similar time which had already been dipped and repeatedly coated with SeaFram for a day.  I rubbed off what I could of the looser carbon first leaving gum imbedded carbon and lots of it but less than your piston.  My container did not look close to yours.  It was barely discolored being mostly some minute particles of carbon and not many which fell off.  The soaking had close to zero effect on the buildup on my piston.

 

Borat: However, by the looks of the residue in the container, it seems to have had some effect. 

 

Did you rub off the loose and flaky stuff first?

The blown up picture seems to show caked on gummed carbon on the rings.  Is that correct? 

Again, given the look of the piston I’d say it did not have any useful effect regardless of what was responsible for the rings loosening.

I’ve had the gum bound chips in SeaFoam for three days with no noticeable breakup of any varnish.  With swirling the cup nothing in there changes.

 

We have somewhat similar piston tests but differ widely on the conclusion. 

 

Borat:  However, my results seem to indicate that there is some redeeming value to using SeaFoam.

 

How big is “some”?  From what I can see “some” is very small and not worth making a claim for it having “redeeming value”.  After seeing what SeaFoam did with your piston I would not make any positive claim but evidently you evaluate that outcome differently.

 

For me it did not break down gummed carbon in a cup over days. 

For you it loosened the rings. 

For me it had not effect on the piston.

For your piston it does not seem to have had an effect either. 

For you it seemed to make a motor run better although you said you could not directly attribute it to SeaFoam. 

For me three similar applications to a 7hp yielded no result.  But I checked out the head interior and valve area first, put in a gummed plug and laid out a tarp to catch any purged particles.  There was no change in the head/valve area, the plug was the same and no particles found on the tarp. 

 

I come to a much different evaluation of the usefulness of SeaFoam as a gum and varnish remover for the head area or carb, as a motor rejuvenator or as a moisture/water eliminator.  It may have some usefulness as a lub.

 

Although our tests yield basically the same result our evaluation of those results differ markedly.