Outdoor Power Equipment (Lawn Mowers, Snow Blowers, Chain Saws and more) Discussions

I’m a long time fan and customer of the Ariens Company...in my experience they always produced tough hard working products, engineered to last, and built from quality components.   But right now I’m having trouble figuring out exactly what an Ariens product is supposed to be. 

I was in Home Depot and noticed two Ariens roto-tillers.  At first glance I was impressed when I saw that they were powered by a Subaru engine, which in my experience, has proven to be a very reliable brand. But on close inspection I saw that the tines were stamped out of the flimsiest metal one could imagine.  When I went to play with the gear shift lever the rubber grip cover came right off in my hand.  All in all they seemed cheap and very shoddy”.

I’d really like to know what a current Ariens product is.  Is it a top line product worthy of a premium price that will last a long time?  Or is it a mediocre product with planned obsolescence that will fail in short order and need to be purchased again in a few years.

The perceived value of the brand name "Ariens", and therefore the entire Ariens line, is only as good as the "worse built product" that they choose to put their name on.

You're pretty much aware that I've been saying that all along.  Ariens is on the slippery slope to quick profits at the expense of quality production.  Their introduction to the box stores was the first sign that something had changed.  Ariens is riding on their name.  They will get away with it for a few years until the consumer smartens up.  Then they will either re-invent their business and revert back to quality or continue to slide into the ranks of mediocrity and possibly extinction.

They are morphing to MTD.

This is the state of the current North American manufacturing sector. Publicly traded companies, driven by unreasonable shareholder greed, are forced to find more & more ways to reduce costs (often resulting in a reduction of quality) to increase returns to the shareholders. This means that their suppliers must follow suit if they are to remain on the shelves. The result is often outsourcing to overseas suppliers who are not shy to lower quality to produce lower cost products. Private companies (Ariens) have no choice but to follow suit to stay alive, until they either ruin their name & go out of business anyway, or find some way to reach a cost / quality equilibrium that consumers will accept.

On the other hand we have the consumers, who have been indoctrinated by mass marketing techniques to feel the need to buy new cars, kitchen appliances, computers, whatever, far more frequently than necessary to keep manufacturing going. So consumers look for products at a cost point that will allow them to do just that. So manufacturers must find ways to reduce costs.

I don't know what the answer is, but I will get down off my soap box now.

GtWtNorth wrote:

Very well put. 

Bottom line is that the consumer is as much at fault as manufacturers who cut corners.  Let's face it.  I'm guessing that 90% of consumers don't know sh!t about most things they buy.  Particularly anything complicated and utilitarian products are probably the most misunderstood  and under appreciated.  Twenty years ago, I didn't know what a good snow thrower was.  I had never owned one before and suddenly was in need of one.  First one I bought was a used 10/32 Craftsman which was, without a doubt, the very worst machine of any kind that I had ever owned.  That machine would work for exactly 45 minutes then something would fall off or break.  It was a nightmare on wheels.  I decided to buy  a new one.   So, in my ignorance, I figured a new Craftsman would be a good machine and it was.  However, by the time it was ten years old, it was starting to show it's age.  Thankfully the INTERNET and forums such as this evolved  and I had learned a lot about snow throwers.   I made a conscious decision to buy "quality" this time.  I bought the Simplicity and haven't looked back. 

Now, if I, myself, who is pretty much a motor head, wasn't very wise in my initial purchases,  how many others open up a flier from a box store, see a snow thrower on sale for $599.00, and run down to buy it without any consideration of how well the product is really built.   Nowadays, we have the luxury of doing a lot of research from the comfort of our homes.  If a person has a computer, there's no real reason that a thorough search cannot be done and wise decisions made.   That, however would require the interest of the individual about to make the purchase.  I still believe that only 10% of us will actually do that.  Therefore, the other 90% will ensure that mediocrity prevails.

GtWtNorth – Very insightful analysis.  I worked for a German company for many years and they operated under a long range 20 year business plan.  Currently I work for a public American company and long range planning is 3 month...or until the next quarterly earnings report.

Borat – Yes, you have been saying this for some time.  However based on my personal experience, I never felt it applied to Ariens.  In 1987 I purchased my first Ariens product...a lawnmower.  Paid $499 for it, which was a lot of money back then.  But it ran flawlessly for 18 years until the engine started to wear out.  I feel like I got good value for my money. 

Based on that experience, whenever I needed something I never looked farther than Ariens. If Ariens made what I needed I just bought it.  And everything was well built.  Even my most recent purchases...an Ariens 11.5hp snow thrower in 2007, and an Ariens 7hp single stage snowblower last year both seem rugged and well built.  So all in all I always felt that Arien’s commitment to quality wasn’t an issue.

That was until I saw their current rototillers, edger, and lawn mowers.  What the #%&.  I think there’s more steel in just the forged tines of my 1989 Ariens tiller than in the whole unit of their new machine. 

Borat, I was one of the 90% you referenced that never research their purchases.  I always trusted the Ariens name and just blindly bought an “Ariens” anytime I needed something...but never, ever again after seeing their current products.

Re:

Customers Fault?  You mean the customers who now have a choice of shopping at HD, Lowes or the ONE private dealer left who is now 50 miles away.  The customers who just lost 40% of their $$$$ in the market.  Ariens, Toro etc know exactly what they are doing.  By eliminating the private dealer and getting in the box store they will make sales.  How well the product is made will become relative.  ariens may still be a top name in a few years but that does not mean the quality is not greatly deminsihed.  It might be great quality compared to to the Pouyan or whatever sitting next to it...assuming everything is really not already made by the same company!

Well, I have to admit to a certain extend, I am one of those customers who shops at Home Depot, Walmart, and Costco.  My expectation of low price is what kept these places in business, and they keep delivering to my expectation.  That's not to say that I don't have a discerning eye and not expect quality products.  But with high and unreasonable cost of repair and maintenance, for consumers, it is so much easier to buy new and not having to put up with the games and deception of repair shops.  Not too many people want to wait 4 weeks to get their equipment repaired with a $200 bill.

A Snapper looks like an Ariens which is slightly different from a Lawnboy which is not too different from a Toro.  Even if they come out of different factories, the designs have converged to the same.  Like salt and sugar that comes in different packging, all are essentially the same underneath.  If consumers don't expect more from a product other than low price, the reseller and manufacturers will deliver exactly just that.

well I guess to you it doesnt matter if u put salt in ur coffee and sugar on ur burger lol.

mikiewest wrote:

I don't intentionally put salt in my coffee, but I do put salt AND sugar on my burger in the form of ketchup.  Subtle, isn't it?

Back to the topic at hand, the salt and sugar comment in my previous post was meant as a commodity.   With that context in mind, feel free to make relevant contribution to this thread.

never did like ketchup, but lighten up aa only joking.Anyway I think you have a great machine.Wow did I just say that??LOL.But I also feel there's a place for machines of less quality.My mom has a small driveway and her sears snowblower is more than adequate.Will it last 20 yrs?probably not but she also did not want to spend $1000 on a blower.Obvioulsly MTD knows there r people who just need a mediocre blower.When I told my brother what I spent on my Simplicity,he thought I was crazy.He has a 5hp ariens and only bought it becauce home depot dicounted it 30%.He likes it and hasnt had any problems in 3yrs.Now concerning ariens,I think they have quality snowblowers after reading Snowmanns dissertation on the internals of ariens snowblowers.He explained what ariens used and why.Maybe someone can do the same for simplicity or honda.It would be interesting to see what the difference is.Also maybe someone can challenge snowmanns responses.Also Frank Zappa rules........Joes Garage..........

Frank Zappa rules........Joes Garage..........

Where did that come from? 

Apostrophe, Over-night Sensation and 200 Motels, a couple of my favourites from Frank.  Too bad his music was too much off the wall for most folks.  He never did get the recognition that he truly deserved.  Not that he wasn't famous.  He certainly was.  However, he never achieved the level of respect he deserved as a musician.  The guy was a phenomenal guitarist,  a creative thinker and outspoken activist.   Too bad he left us so soon. 

was listening to zappa on my way home ...man He was a genius.........

mikiewest wrote:

Hehe.  That's some tangential spontaneity talent you got there.   I've heard of Frank Zappa and Joes Garage, not too familiar with them though.  A co-worker introduced me to Pink Floyd several years ago, too cynical for my taste at first, but I quickly got hooked on it. 

Home Depot aggressive discount of years past is what get people through their doors.  I could have bought the Ariens snowblower for some crazy discount that would upset local OPE shops, but I didn't.  A snowblower purchase is not a frequent one, I don't want to get it just because it's cheap.  The snowblower that I finally bought did cost me a bit of money, it has certain quirky characteristics and different from the rest of the pack, but I like that.